House of Lords Journal Volume 6: 31 July 1643

DIE Lunæ, videlicet, 31 die Julii.

PRAYERS.

Countess of Sunderland; a Pass.

Ordered, That the Countess of Sunderland shall have a Pass, to go to Penshurst, in Kent, with a Coach and Six Horses, Six Saddle-horses, and a Sumpter, and to have Leave to go to Oxford, from thence, when she shall think fit.

Sir James Montgomery, a Pass.

Ordered, That Sir James Montgomery shall have a Pass, to go into Ireland, to attend his Charge there; and that he shall have Leave to go to Oxford, to dispatch his necessary Affairs, and from thence to go into Scotland, and so into Ireland; and to carry with him Two Servants, and Humphrey Galbreth, with their Arms, Utensils, and all other Necessaries for their Journey.

E. Portland and L. Conway to be bailed.

The House took into Consideration the Petitions of the Earl of Portland, and the Lord Viscount Conway: And it is Ordered, That they shall be bailed, to appear upon Summons before this House; and the Gentleman Usher is to signify to them so much, that so they may provide their Bail.

E. of Holland's Servant, a Pass.

Ordered, That, a Servant of the Earl of Holland, shall have a Pass, to go into France.

Dalton, a Pass.

Ordered, That Mr. Maurice Dalton shall have a Pass, to go to Henly, and return again to London.

Maxwell and Irwin, a Pass.

Ordered, That Mr. Rob't Maxwell and Rob't Irvin shall have a Pass, to go into Holland.

Jennings and Sir Thomas Dawes, concerning the Decree against Sir Phillibert Vernatti.

Upon reading the Petition of Thomas Jennings Esquire, shewing, "That, by a Decree and Judgement of this House, lately made and pronounced, against Sir Phillibert Vernatt, it appears that Sir Tho. Dawes is therein concerned, and to be first satisfied his Debt thereby declared, before any Fruit or Benefit can be had or enjoyed by the Petitioner.

"That the Petitioner hath addressed himself to Sir Tho. Dawes, to state his Debt, and to contrive a Way for his Payment; but Sir Tho. Dawes pretends other Debts by Bond, in which the Petitioner with others stand bound, than in Truth are real Debts, but were entered into by Sir Abraham Dawes his late Father, merely in Trust, and so declared under his Hand and Seal to Mr. Latch, the Petitioner's Father-in-law; yet Sir Tho. pretends them to be just Debts, and by that Means seeks Delays, to prevent all Fruit and Benefit to the Petitioner of the said Decree and Judgement, knowing himself is to be first satisfied; humbly praying some speedy Directions from their Lordships herein."

(fn. 1) Ordered, That it be referred to Mr. Justice Reeves and Mr. Justice Bacon, to examine this Business, and make Report thereof to this House.

The Earl of Northumb. reported, "That, on Saturday last, some Commanders from the Lord General presented to the Committee for the Safety some Propositions from the Lord General, concerning the State of the Army; which the Committee thought fit for the Debate and Consideration of both Houses of Parliament."

The said Propositions, or Considerations, were read, as followeth:

"Considerations to be offered to the Parliament, of the Weakness of the Army, and the Expedients for Remedy thereof.

State of the Army, from the Lord General.

"1. The Number of Foot Three Thousand marching Men, at least Three Thousand sick, occasioned by the Want of Pay, ill Cloathing, and all other Miseries which attend an unpaid, sickly Army.

"The Number of the Horse Two Thousand Five Hundred (Three Thousand last Muster) occasioned by Loss of Horses upon hard Duty and Service, Recruits of Horse though often desired not performed; besides, by reason of a new Army, the present Regiments much lessened, listing themselves elsewhere for the new Army, expecting better Pay and Cloathing, and, upon their going hence, are entertained and protected; and great Discouragements and Scandals put upon his Excellency, the Officers, and Army, either through false Suggestions of some amongst us, or the Misunderstanding of others, poisoning the Affections of the People, which hinder Recruits and Contributions.

"Remedies for which Mischiefs, offer these Things:

Remedies proposed by him.

"1. A speedy Pay of the Arrears, and a constant Pay settled for the future, which will draw on Recruits, and give Way to more strict Discipline: and that Cloaths may be provided, according to a Thousand for every Regiment, to which Purpose an Ordinance for a Press be immediately passed.

"2. That Eight Hundred Horses be sent, and Two Hundred Monthly provided for Recruits.

"3. That the Forces to be raised may not be put into a new Army, until the old Regiments be recruited; no Officer or Soldier to be entertained into any other Employment, and that severe Punishment be executed upon such, and those that entertain them.

"4. That such as shall be found guilty of any Scandals laid upon his Excellency, any of his Officers, or Army, may be severely punished, whereby the like Offences may be no more committed; and a Declaration of both Houses passed, for the Vindication of his Excellency and them.

"5. That, full Power having been given to his Excellency, by an Ordinance of both Houses, for the granting of all Commissions, for the raising or commanding of any Forces, Towns, or Garrisons, it is conceived most requisite for the better Ordering of the Army, that no Commission be granted whatsoever, but from his Excellency; the Want of which breeds Disobedience to his Excellency's Commands, to the Prejudice of the Kingdom.

"6. That the Loss of the West is rumoured to be occasioned by his Excellency; desired, it may be thoroughly examined what the Loss was, and the Occasions of it.

July 28, 1643.

"Essex."

This House taking these Considerations into serious Debate, and in the Conclusion, made these Resolutions, as the Sense of this House:

Resolutions of the House upon them.

"1. That the Lord General's Army shall be recruited in the First Place, by all possible Means; and, for the speedier expediting thereof, their Lordships think it fit an Ordinance of both Houses be passed, for pressing of Soldiers.

"2. That a Declaration be published, to vindicate the Lord General, and his Commanders and Officers, from salse Scandals and Aspersions.

"3. That a Declaration may be published, That no Commander or Soldier of the Lord General's Army shall be entertained in the City, or any other; if they be, they shall be punished.

"4. That such Persons that shall be recommended to be employed in the Armies under the Lord General shall be under his Command, and receive their Commissions from him.

"5. That it be recommended to the House of Commons, to provide for the paying the Arrears of the Army, and to recruit him with Two Hundred (fn. 2) Horses Monthly.

"6. That their Lordships hold it fit, that the Rumour of the losing the West be examined."

Ordered, That these Considerations and Remedies, with the Sense of this House, shall be communicated to the House of Commons, at a Conference, and their Concurrence herein desired.

Message to the H. C. for a Conference about them.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Mr. Serjeant Whitfeilde and Mr. Serjeant Fynch:

To desire a Conference, in the Painted Chamber, touching some Propositions received from the Lord General.

The Answer returned was:

Answer.

That the House of Commons will give a present Conference, as is desired.

This House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed.

Message from thence, with Names to be added to the Committee of Sequestrations for Northampton;

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Knightly, &c.

To desire their Lordships Concurrence, that the Persons following may be added to the Committee of Sequestrations for the County of North'ton:

Agreed to.

and for Cambridge.

2. To desire Concurrence, that these Persons following may be added to the Committee of Sequestrations, for the County of Cambridge and the Isle of Ely:

Agreed to.

with Orders;

3. To desire Concurrence in several Orders.

and to expedite the One about Newcastle.

4. To desire Expedition in the Order concerning Newcastle.

The Answer returned was:

Answer.

That this House agrees in the Names for to be added to the Committees for Sequestrations, for the Counties of North'ton, Cambridge, and the Isle of Ely; touching the other Particulars, their Lordships will take them into Consideration, and return an Answer by Messengers of their own.

Earl of Portland and Lord Conway bailed.

Next, the Speaker acquainted the House, "That the Earl of Portland and the Lord Viscount Conway have offered their Bail;" which the House approved of.

The Earl of Portland and the Lord Viscount Conway were called in, who standing at the Clerk's Table, the Bail entered into Recognizance, as followeth:

Basil Comes de Denbigh, et Johannes Dominus de Hunsdon, recognoverunt, et quemlibet eorum recognovit, se debere Domino Regi Mille Libras, levari ex Terris, Tenementis, Bonis, et Catallis eorum cujuslibet, ad usum Domini Regis.

The Condition of the abovesaid Recognizance is, That if the Right Honourable Jerom Earl of Portland shall, within Three Days after Notice left at his House or Lodging, appear before the Lords in Parliament, then this Recognizance to be void; else to be in full Force and Virtue.

Guilielmus de Bedford, et Edwardus Dominus Howard de Est. recognoverunt, et quemlibet eorum recognovit, se debere Domino Regi Mille Libras, levari ex Terris, Tenementis, Bonis, et Catallis eorum cujuslibet, ad usum Domini Regis.

The Condition of the abovesaid Recognizance is, That if the Right Honourable Edward Lord Viscount Conway shall, within Three Days after Notice left at his House or Lodging, appear before the Lords in Parliament, then this Recognizance to be void; else to remain in full Force and Virtue.

Adjourn.

House adjourned till 10^a cras.