House of Commons Journal Volume 4: 26 February 1646

Die Jovis, 26 Februarii, 1645.

Payers.

WHereas Sir William Allenson Knight, a Member of the House of Commons, holdeth by Lease, for Term of Years, the Prebend of Skelton, with the Dividend of Howdon, belonging thereunto, of Martin Sandis, of Owmbersley within the County of Worcester, Esquire; who is, and long hath been in Arms against the Parliament: It is this Day Ordered, That, for the Three Years last by-past, and during the Term of the Sequestration of the said Delinquent's Estate, Sir Wm. Allenson Knight, towards his Damages and Losses, shall have and receive the full Benefit of the said Prebend and Dividend, without being accountable to Mr. Sandys, or any claiming by or under him, or to the State, therefore.

The Lords Amendment to the Fifth Proposition, to which they adhered; and their Reasons for their Adhering; delivered by them at the last Conference concerning the Propositions; were this Day read.

Resolved, &c. That this House doth adhere to the Fifth Proposition, as it went from hence, without any Addition.

Resolved, &c. That a free Conference be desired with the Lords, upon the Matter of the last Conference, concerning the Propositions.

Mr. Sollicitor, Mr. Nathanael Fiennes, Mr. Prideaux, Mr. Rous, Sir Henry Vane junior, Mr. Recorder, Mr. Tate, Mr. Philip Stapleton, Sir Wm. Lewes, Mr. Long;

This Committee, or any Three of them, are appointed immediately to withdraw; and to prepare Reasons, to be offered to the Lords at a free Conference, Why this House doth adhere to the Fifth Proposition, as it went hence, without Addition.

Mr. Tate was appointed to go to the Lords, and desire a free Conference with them, upon the Matter of the last Conference, concerning the Propositions: And was also to press the Lords to pass the Votes sent from this House, concerning the Tryers of Elders; and likewise the Order of this House, giving further Power to the Committee at Goldsmiths-Hall; and the Form of the Ordinance for Discharge of Delinquents upon their Compositions.

Mr. Tate brings Answer from the Lords, That they do agree to a free Conference, presently, upon the Matter of the last Conference, concerning the Propositions: They have passed the Votes for Tryers of Elders: And, to the rest, they will send Answer by Messengers of their own.

The Two Letters from the Parliament of Scotland, from St. Andros, of 3 Februarii 1646, stilo loci, were this Day read.

Resolved, &c. That the Commissioners of Scotland be desired to return the Answer of the Parliament of Scotland, touching the Delivery of the Towns formerly demanded by the Parliament of England.

The Lords Concurrence to be desired herein.

Whereas the Parliament of Scotland do, by their Letter, of the Third of February 1646, directed to the Lords and Commons, assembled in the Parliament of England, at Westminster, demand Payment to be made, before the Third Day of May next, of the Sums of Money duly owing by the Houses of Parliament to the Kingdom of Scotland, and their Armies in England and Ireland, according to the Treaties between the Two Kingdoms; the Accompt whereof will be given in by their Commissioners: The said Commissioners are desired to give in the Accompt of the said Monies accordingly.

The Lords Concurrence to be desired herein.

In pursuance of an Order, of 31 Octobris 1645; whereby the Monies that the Maintenance of the Horse set-forth by the Eastern Association, for Three Months longer, shall amount unto, are charged upon the Receipts of the Excise;

It is Resolved, &c. That the Sum of Twenty thousand Pounds be charged upon the Receipts of the Excise, to be paid in Course, after other Monies charged upon the said Receipts by any former Order of this House.

An Ordinance for charging and reimbursing, out of the Receipts of the Excise, Twenty thousand Pounds, with Interest after the Rate of Eight Pounds per Centum for the Forbearance thereof, for the Maintenance of the Horse and Dragoons of the Eastern Association, employed for the Blocking up of Newarke, was this Day read; and, upon the Question, passed; and ordered to be sent unto the Lords for their Concurrence.

An Ordinance for charging and reimbursing, out of the Receipts of the Excise, the Sum of Two thousand Five hundred Pounds, to be employed for the Service against Dennington-Castle, was this Day read; and, upon the Question, passed; and ordered to be sent unto the Lords for their Concurrence.

An Ordinance for charging and reimbursing, out of the Receipts of the Excise, the Sum of Six hundred Pounds, with Interest, to be employed for the Pay of the Kentish Horse before Dennington-Castle, was this Day read; and, upon the Question, passed; and ordered to be sent unto the Lords for their Concurrence.

An Ordinance for charging and reimbursing, out of the Receipts of the Excise, the Sum of Two thousand Pounds, with Interest, to be employed for the Use of the Garison of Abingdon, was this Day read; and, upon the Question, passed; and ordered to be sent unto the Lords for their Concurrence.

Mr. Reynolds, according to former Order, carried to the Lords, for their Concurrence, the Amendment to the Lords Order, concerning the Officers belonging to the Court of Wards and Liveries: And the Ordinance for discharging the Wardship of Wm. Wray Esquire, Son of Sir Christopher Wray Knight, a Member of this House, deceased: Also the Order for renewing Mr. Annesly, Sir Robert King, and Colonel Beale's Commission.

Sir Robert Pye carried to the Lords, for their Concurrence, the Order concerning an Answer from the Scotts Commissioners, touching the Towns demanded by the Parliament of England, of the Parliament of Scotland; and the Order concerning the Demand, in the Letter from the Parliament of Scotland, of the Monies due to that Kingdom, and their Armies, before the Third of May next.

Mr. Prideaux reports, from the Committee, the Heads of the Reasons to be delivered to the Lords, in Answer to their Reasons for their inserting a Clause in the Fifth Proposition: The which were read; and were in bæc verba; viz.

That this Expression makes it less clear;

1. Because this Clause, in pursuance of it, will be subject to uncertain Constructions, and Variety of Interpretations, from all those that shall be interessed in these Propositions; viz. the King, the Two Houses of Parliament, and the Kingdom of Scotland; and may prejudice the Freedom which is fit to be in the Parliament, for the Perfecting of what is already begun, by any necessary Addition or Alteration; although, in this Matter of Religion, and ChurchGovernment, this House doth intend to prosecute and pursue That which is already agreed upon by both Houses of Parliament: Which, notwithstanding, they cannot conceive to be . . . . to insert in the Propositions; in respect of the King, or others, that are or may be interessed in these Propositions.

2. That what hath been already passed by Ordinance or Votes of both Houses of Parliament (wherein the chief and essential Parts, in Matters of Religion and ChurchGovernment, are agreed) doth sufficiently shew, What kind of Reformation in Religion and Church-Government, both Houses of Parliament do desire: And to determine or ascertain any thing which is futurely to be done by both Houses, otherwise than what shall be agreed by both Houses of Parliament, will put it upon the Inconveniences before alleged.

3. The Third Reason, we conceive, is already answered.

That the House of Commons hath been, and is, so desirous to make all Things, concerning Religion and ChurchGovernment to be certain; that, having formerly sent divers Votes concerning the same unto your Lordships, whereupon they have received no Answer, resolving to finish and perfect the Whole with all possible Speed, they conceive this Addition fit to be left out; in regard, with your Lordships speedy Concurrence, they are hopeful to have the Particulars themselves, yet remaining, ready to be presented unto the King: And to this Proposition, as it was sent up by them to your Lordships, they desire your Lordships speedy Concurrence; the House of Commons being of Opinion, That the Delay of the Propositions for a safe and well-grounded Peace will be very prejudicial to the Kingdoms:

And, upon the Question, assented unto, to be the Heads of the Reasons to be offered to the Lords by the Managers of the free Conference.

Ordered, That the former Directions to the Committee of both Kingdoms, to give Order to Colonel Whaley to attend the Motions of the King's Horse, be renewed: And that the Members of this House that are of the Committee of both Kingdoms, do give an Account to this House, To-morrow Morning, What has been done in Pursuance and Obedience of the said Orders and Directions.

Sir Thomas Dacres, Mr. Alderman Pennington, Sir John Francklyn, Mr. Alderman Atkin, Mr. Long, Mr. Herbert, Colonel Thomson;

This Committee, or any Three of them, are to consider of the Book of Accompts of the Demands of Widows of Officers and Soldiers slain in the Parliament's Service, and of the Trains of Artillery and Waggoners, delivered in to this House from Mr. Auditor Broad: And that they do distribute unto them, and pay out, the Four thousand Pounds, appointed for them by Two late Ordinances, according to the former Orders of this House.

Sir Robert Pye brings Answer from the Lords, That they do agree in both the Orders concerning the Scotts Commissioners.

The House was informed, That a Trumpeter from Oxon was at the Door; who brought a Letter from Sir Henry Berd to Sir Arthur Hesilrig:

The Letter was delivered in, and a Petition with it.

Resolved, &c. That the Trumpeter that brought this Letter to Sir Arthur Hesilrig, be forthwith committed Prisoner to the Serjeant at Arms attending on this House.

Resolved, &c. That the Committee of Examinations, or any Three of them, do forthwith examine this Trumpeter: And that they give Order for the Search of him, and his Lodgings, for Letters, Papers, or any other Matter.

An Ordinance for trying Mr. Wm. Murray, according to the Course of War, as a Spy, was this Day read the First and Second time.

Resolved, &c. That Sir Thomas Fairfax General of the Forces raised by the Houses of Parliament, Serjeant-MajorGeneral Skippon, Colonel Rowland Wilson, Colonel Owen Rowe, Colonel Edward Hooker, Colonel Ralph Harrison, Colonel Zachary, Colonel Hardwick, Colonel Thomas Gower, Colonel George Langham, Colonel George Payne, Colonel Thomas Randall, Colonel Wm. Willougby, Colonel John Bradley, Lieutenant-Colonel Francis Rowe, Lieutenant-Colonel Francis Bromefield, Major Richard Wollaston, Sir Nathanael Brent Knight, Dr. Walker, Mr. John Mills, Sir James Harrington Knight, Colonel Francis West Lieutenant of the Tower, Colonel Charles Fleetwood, Colonel Humfries, Colonel Richard Turner, Colonel Randolph Manwaring, Colonel Edmund Harvey, Colonel Robert Manwaring, Colonel Matthew Shepperd, and Lieutenant-Colonel Thomas Buxton, Colonel Whitchcott, Colonel Pinder, Lieutenant-Colonel Welden, Colonel Wm. Underwood, Colonel Thomas Player, Colonel Prince, Colonel Samuel Harsnett, Lieutenant-Colonel Nathanael Camfield, Wm. Molins, Colonel John Owen, Colonel Webb, Colonel John Bradley, John Bradshaw and Wm. Steel Esquires, shall be inserted in the Ordinance for Tryal of Mr. Wm. Murray.

The Question being put, Whether the Ordinance for Tryal of Mr. Wm. Murray, as a Spy, should be committed, or not;

It passed with the Negative.

Then the Ordinance being put to the Question, it was assented unto; and ordered to be sent to the Lords for their Concurrence.

Mr. Lisle is appointed to carry it to the Lords.

Resolved, &c. That the Grand Committee of the House for Religion do sit To-morrow Morning, to take into Consideration the Ordinance concerning Church-Government: And that the said Ordinance be proceeded in de die in diem, until it shall be dispatched.