House of Lords Journal Volume 4: 11 February 1641

Die Jovis, videlicet, 11 die Februarii.

PRAYERS.

Butler and Gibson to speak with the Earl of Strafford.

Ordered, That Mr. George Butler hath Leave to speak with the Earl of Strafford at The Tower, about some Business which concerns him; but this to be for One Time.

Ordered, That Sir John Gibson have Leave to speak with the Earl of Strafford about Business; and this to be but Once.

The Earl of Newcastle had Leave granted him to speak with the Lord Archbishop of Cant.

Sir Walter Norton to be served with a Ne exeat Regnum.

Upon a Motion, That Sir Walter Norton, Baronet, of Nova Scotia, having been charged with divers Misdemeanors, whereupon it is suspected he will make an Escape out of the Kingdom; therefore it was Ordered, That the Lord Keeper do grant a Ne exeat Regnum against the said Sir Walter Norton.

Order between Vernatti and Latch.

Ordered, That the Lords Committees for Petitions, in hearing the Cause between Sir Phillip Vernatti, and Mr. Latch may, if they see Cause, ask the Opinions of what Judges they please, upon any Point of Law that shall arise in the Case.

Two Members of the High Commission Court, Petition, concerning Wheeler's Damages.

Upon reading the Petition of Sir John Lambe, Knight, and Dr. Duck; alledging, That they are to pay, by Order of this House, Damages to Mary Wheeler, of Colchester, for setting their Hands to a Warrant, or Attachment, of the High Commission Court; and forasmuch as they alledge that they were never heard therein; therefore the House did Order, That that Part which concerns the said Sir Jo. Lambe and Dr. Duck be respited; and no Execution of the Order therein, until they be heard before the Lords Committees; but that Part of the Order which concerns the other Parties to be put in Execution.

E. Down's Cause.

Ordered, That, upon Tuesday next, the Earl of Downe's Cause shall be heard; and that Mr. Dutton is to give his Answer, concerning the waving of his Privilege, as a Member of the House of Commons.

Lords Commissioners acquaint the

House with their further Proceedings in the Treaty with the Scots.

The Earl of Bristoll acquainted the House, That the Lords Commissioners were ready to give an Account to the House, how far they had proceeded in the Treaty with the Scotts since the last Account which was given to this House. And the House being willing to hear the Narration, there were divers Papers produced. The First was containing the Scottish Commissioners Proposition concerning their Seventh Demand, which was to this Effect read:

Proposition of the Scots, about their Seventh Demand.

"Being confident that the Parliament will fully expedite Our Sixth Demand, and in due Time consider of such Things as are necessary for our timous Relief; we conceive it more convenient at another Occasion to return to the Consideration of such Things as are not yet determined, than now to make any Delay; and therefore we proceed to the Seventh Demand, concerning which, since it is manifest that His Majesty's Subjects of Scotland, and their Proceedings, have been very much wronged by the sinister Informations of such as for their own Ends have called their Loyalty in Question, and have disturbed the Peace of His Majesty's Dominions; it is our humble and earnest Desires, that, as His Majesty hath been graciously pleased to grant His Royal Approbation to the Acts of the late Parliament of Scotland, wherein all such Declarations, Proclamations, Acts, Books, Libels, and Pamphlets, as have been made, written, or published, against His loyal and dutiful Subjects, are recalled, and ordained to be suppressed and destroyed; so His Majesty may be pleased to give Order that the same may be recalled, suppressed, and forbidden, in England and Ireland; and that the Loyalty, Integrity, and Faithfulness of His Majesty's Subjects of Scotland, towards His Majesty's Royal Person and Government, may, at the Closing of this Treaty of Peace, and at the Time of Public Thanksgiving for the same, be made known in all Places, and at the Parish Kirks of His Majesty's Kingdoms. This we do the more earnestly desire, and confidently expect, from His Majesty's Justice and Goodness, because no Calamity or Distress hath so far vexed, and so deeply wounded, the Hearts of His Majesty's Subjects, as that their Loyalty and Love towards their Native King should have been controverted, and, by the Malignancy of bad Instruments, brought into Suspicion; because they unfeignedly desire and pray for His Majesty's Happiness, and are resolved by all Means, and at all Occasions, to deny themselves and what they have, for His Majesty's Honour.

February 8th, 1640.

"Ad. Blair."

Next was read the Lords Commissioners Answer thereunto, as followeth:

Lords Commissioners Answer thereunto.

"We do agree, That all Declarations, Proclamations, Acts, Books, Libels, and Pamphlets, that have been made and published against the Loyalty and Dutifulness of His Majesty's Subjects of Scotland, shall be recalled, suppressed, and forbidden in England, and Ireland; and that this be reciprocal in Scotland, if any such have been made or published there, in Prejudice of His Majesty's Honour; and this, upon diligent Enquiry, to be done by the Authority of the Parliament next sitting in Scotland; of which the Commissioners of Scotland do promise to have an especial Care: And we do also agree, That, when it shall please Almighty God to grant a happy Close of this Treaty of Peace, the Loyalty of His Majesty's said Subjects shall be made known, at the Time of Public Thanksgiving, in all Places, and particularly in the Parish Churches of His Majesty's Dominions. Unto which we are the rather induced, for that you express how deeply it hath wounded the Hearts of His Majesty's said Subjects, that their Loyalty and Love to His Majesty, their Native King, should be brought in Question and Suspicion; whereas they unfeignedly desire and pray for His Majesty's Happiness, and are resolved; by all Means, and at all Occasions, to deny themselves, and what they have, for His Majesty's Honour."

After this was read the Scottish Commissioners Proposition concerning their Eighth and last Demand; as followeth:

Eighth Demand of the Scots read.

Concerning our last Demand, for an happy and durable Peace, which is the chiefest of our Desires, and unto which all the former Seven Articles, being now agreed upon, are as many Preparations; we do first of all desire, That all Monuments, Tokens, and Shews of Hostility, upon the Borders of the Two Kingdoms, may be taken away; and, because the Fortification of Barwicke and Carlile can serve for no Use but against His Majesty's Kingdom of Scotland, and may, by some Persons intrusted therewith, upon their Discontent, or desire to make a Breach, be suddenly abused, against the Will of the King and Kingdom; and since the Standing of these Fortifications will be but a Memory of such Evils as are to be buried in Oblivion, and an Occasion of such Suspicions, Jealousies, and Temptations, as are not to be harboured or entertained in the Hearts of Brethren, which moved King James, of Happy Memory, at His Entry into England, and at the Beginning of the Conjunction now to be perfected by King Charles, to cause the removing of the Ordnance, and slighting of the Works, at Barwick: Upon these and many the like Considerations, it is our Desires, That not only the Garrisons may be removed from Barwick and Carlile, but that the Works may be slighted, and the Places dismantled, since the One Fortification hath been made upon the Occasion of the late unhappy Troubles, and the other was built in the Time of Division and Enmity between the Two Kingdoms; which were then under Two Kings, and are now, in the merciful Providence of God, and are ever hereafter to be, united under one Head and Monarch.

10 Feb. 1640.

"Ad. Blair."

Lords Commissioners desire the Advice of the House in answering this.

Message to the Commons for Conference about the Treaty.

Then the Lords Commissioners desired the Advice of the House, concerning the last Demand, having done nothing therein; it being a Business of so much Importance; therefore left it to the Consideration of the House. Hereupon the House resolved upon a Conference; and a Message was sent, by the Master of the Rolls and Mr. Baron Henden, to the House of Commons: To let them know that their Lordships do desire a present Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, in the Painted Chamber, concerning the Treaty of both Kingdoms.

The House considers what is fit to be proposed at the Conference.

In the mean Time, the House considered what was fit to be proposed at the Conference; and it was Ordered, That the Papers read here, shall be likewise read at the Conference; and then to let the House of Commons know, That this House will debate the Business; and, when they have done the like, their Lordships will be ready to give them a free Conference about it, if they shall desire it: or else their Lordships will desire one of them, when they shall see it fit.

Answer from the H. C.

The Answer returned concerning the Conference was: That the House of Commons will give a Meeting presently, as is desired.

Lords appointed to render the King Thanks, to attend Him this Afternoon.

Those Lords that were appointed Yesterday to render the King Thanks for His Favours, were required by the House to attend His Majesty this Afternoon, for that Purpose.

Obsolete Laws to be considered.

Memorandum, It was moved, That some Lords might be appointed, to consider of the obsolete Laws, and penal Statutes, which are obnoxious to the Subject, and to present them to this House.

Conference reported.

The Earl of Bristoll was appointed to deliver and report the Conference. And, the House being adjourned during Pleasure, the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed; and the Earl of Bristoll reported, That he had delivered the Papers which were read here to the House of Commons, and had likewise performed that which this House did enjoin him.

Report, Moulson versus Moulson.

Report being made to the House, That the Lords Committees having considered of the Petition of Dame Anne Moulson, Widow, Executrix of the last Will and Testament of Sir Tho. Moulson, Knight, Alderman of the City of London, who, dying possessed of a great Estate, both in Land and Money, bequeathed a good Part of his Estate to Tho. Moulson, his Nephew; between whom and the said Lady Moulson there grew a Suit in Chancery, where, at a Hearing, the late Lord Keeper Fynch did make a Decree, which the said Lady Moulson conceives to be most unjust, and contrary to the said Will; the Proceedings being opened at large before the Lords Committees, by Counsel on both Sides, and it appearing to their Lordships to be a weighty Business, worthy of further Consideration, there being some Particulars wherein their Lordships were not clearly satisfied, did think the Cause fit to be reviewed; it was thereupon Ordered, That this Cause shall receive a Review, and be heard this Day Fortnight at the Bar, with Counsel on both Sides, in open Court, and receive such Determination as shall seem just and reasonable.

A Proclamation for Lord Finch's Appearance preparing.

After this, the Lord Keeper signified to the House, That Mr. Attorney General is preparing a Proclamation, to be sent abroad, to summon in the Lord Fynch.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Veneris, videlicet, in 12^m diem instantis Februarii, hora nona, Dominis sic decernentibus.