House of Lords Journal Volume 10: 28 October 1648

DIE Saturni, 28 die Octobris.

PRAYERS, by Mr. Salwey.

Comes Manchest'r, Speaker.

Answer from the H. C.

Sir Edward Leech and Mr. Page return with this Answer from the House of Commons:

That they will send an Answer to the Message Yesterday, by Messengers of their own.

Message from thence, with Votes about the King's Answer; with a Letter of the E. of Ormond's;-and a Letter to the Commissioners with the King about them.

A Message from House of Commons, brought up by Mr. Annesley & al.

A Vote that the King's Answer to the Bill for abolishing of Bishops is not satisfactory. Read.

Other Votes concerning several Particulars in the King's Answer.

An Original Letter of the Earl of Ormond's, by which it appears that he is landed in Ireland, making Peace with the Rebels there. (Here enter it.)

Other Letters were read.

They desire the Originals may be returned.

A Letter, that the Commissioners in the Isle of Wight acquaint His Majesty with these Letters. (Here enter it.)

Read, and Agreed to.

The Answer returned was:

Answer.

That this House agrees to the Letter to be sent to the Commissioners concerning the Earl of Ormond's Letter: As to the other Votes in Answer to the King's Paper, their Lordships will take them into Consideration, and will send an Answer by Messengers of their own.

Grigg to be attached.

Upon reading the Affidavit of Mathew Hassall: (Here enter it.)

It is Ordered, That Thomas Grigge, Constable, shall be attached as a Delinquent, and brought before the Lords in Parliament, to answer the said Complaint forthwith.

Message to the H. C. with Votes about the Propositions.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Mr. Page:

1. To desire their Concurrence in the Votes in Answer to the King's Four Propositions sent from the Isle of Wight.

2. To deliver the Names of the Seven Persons that are to remain in the First Exception in the Proposition concerning Delinquents, and desire their Concurrence therein; both Houses having agreed of the Number of Seven.

Votes from the H. C. about them.

Next, the House was adjourned into a Committee during Pleasure, to take into Consideration the Votes that now came from the House of Commons, concerning the King's Answer concerning the Proposition touching the Church.

The House being resumed;

This Vote following was read; videlicet,

"That His Majesty's Answer to that Part of the Proposition that concerns a Bill and Ordinances for abolishing of Bishops, is not satisfactory."

The Question being put, "Whether to agree to this Vote?"

It was Resolved in the Affirmative.

The Second Vote was read; and ordered to be committed to these Lords following:

To meet presently.

The abovesaid Committee reported the said Vote, with an Alteration, which was read.

And the Vote being read, with the said Alteration;

And the Question being put, "Whether to agree to the Vote, with the Alteration now read?

It was Resolved in the Affirmative.

The Second Branch is agreed to.

The Third Branch is agreed to.

The Vote concerning the Sale of Bishops Lands is not agreed to.

The Vote to press the King for the Particulars concerning Reformation of Religion, is agreed to.

The Vote to the Answer concerning the Book of Common Prayer, agreed to.

The Vote concerning the Articles of Christian Religion, agreed to.

The Vote against Mass, was agreed to, with an Alteration.

Message to the H. C. for a Letter to be sent to the Commissioners about them.

Ordered, To let the House of Commons know to what Votes the Lords do agree to; and desire a Conference, on Monday Morning, concerning the Vote touching the selling of Bishops Lands; and that a Letter be sent to the Commissioners, with the Votes inclosed, which are agreed upon; and that Sir Peter Killegrew may be dispatched away with it.

And accordingly a Message was sent presently to the House of Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Mr. Page.

Ld. Colraine and Lady Delawar.

Ordered, That the Cause between the Lady La Warr and the Lord Colerayne is put off till Thursday next, Notice whereof is to be given to the Parties by an Officer of this House; and the Judges to have Notice to be then present.

Scots Prisoners shipped without Authority.

Upon reading the Petition of Colonel Rob't Mountgomery; complaining, "That many Scotch Prisoners are shipped without Authority of Parliament:"

(fn. 1) Ordered, That the Masters of the Ships in whose Custody they are shall give an Account to this House, by what Authority they are shipped; and in the mean Time are to be stayed.

Nicholas to be a Serjeant.

Resolved, That a Writ do issue forth, to call Mr. Robert Nicholas to be a Serjeant at Law.

Mr. Eltonhead and carried this Vote to the House of Commons, for their Concurrence.

Fanshaw and Sydenham, a Pass.

Ordered, That Mr. Thomas Fanshawe and Mr. Wm. Sydenham shall have a Pass, to go into France.

Letter from Colonel Jones, pressing for Supplies for Ireland; and with the following Letters concerning the E. of Ormond's landing there, and treating with the Rebels.

"Honourable Sir,

"In my last (of the 4th Instant) I represented the present Wants of this your Army, both in Men and Money; wherein now again I most earnestly desire we may be supplied, and that with all convenient Speed, considering Ormond's now arriving here, and the Designs by him driven (appearing in the inclosed), which are intended principally to the Disturbance of your Affairs there; his Lordship meeting with the Irish Commissioners on their Treaty began on Monday the 16th present; after which (I have it on good Grounds) all their Powers together are to be employed against this your small Party in this Province, that timely removing hence, (fn. 2) and thither of Ormond's Instruments in whom he most consided will retard him much in his Designs: Yet will it be alike and no less for his Advantage, if he have to work on a necessitated Party (such as this is), on whom large Offers of a plentiful Subsistence (which ours have not) may be much working.

"There are extraordinary and large Taxes laid by the Poll in the Irish Quarters, for making up (it is said) the Sum of Sixty Thousand Pounds for the Prince, who is by the Irish expected here, with his Fleet, as soon as the Treaty is made up between them and Ormond. In this I am much confirmed, that all here in Design is principally for England.

"It is therefore nearly concerning you to prevent this growing Evil, and that rather here than there, by sending hither with all Speed what is for the Work, particularly that we be supplied with Horse (the Life of this Service); our Troops here being weakened by a strange Disease, whereby Three Score Horses have miscarried in some Troops, consisting but of Seventytwo to the Troop.

"This of Ormond's Arrival, and the Discovery made of his Designs, have for the present diverted mine Intentions for advancing in Person, that thereby this Place (to be principally secured) may be provided for, and other Things prepared necessary for a Meeting with that Army, or those Designs of the Rebels so much spoken of. In the mean Time, I shall visit their Quarters by strong Parties, sent out on all Hands for burning and destroying their Corn; and what may be else for their Subsistence, or Accommodation, whereof I trust ere long (with God's Assistance) to give you some good Account. So I rest

Dublin, October the 18th, 1648.

"Your most humble and faithful Servant,

"Mi. Jones.

"To the Honourable Wm. Lenthall Esquire, Speaker to the Honourable the Commons House in Parliament. These present."

Letter from the E. of Ormond to the Chairman of the Catholic Assembly of Kilkenny, for a Troaty.

"After our very hearty Commendations: Being arrived in this Kingdom, qualified with Power to treat and conclude a Peace with the Confederate Roman Catholics, or such as shall be deputed and authorized by them in that Behalf; we have thought fit, by these our Letters, to desire you to make the same known to the Assembly of the said Confederate Roman Catholics now at Kilkenney; as also that, in Pursuance of the Paper of the 13th of May last, delivered to their Commissioners at St. Germains, we expect to receive from them, by Persons fully authorized to treat and conclude, such Propositions as they shall think fit at our House at Caricke, whither we intend to remove, for the better Accommodation and more speedy Dispatch of this Affair, as soon as we shall be advertised by you of the Time when we shall expect them there, which we desire may be with all convenient Expedition. We remain, at Corke, this 4th of October, 1648.

"Your very loving Friend,

"Ormond.

"To our very loving Friend Sir Richard Blake Knight, Chairman to the Assembly of the Confederate Roman Catholics now at Kilkenny."

Letter to Col. Jones, with Intelligence of it.

"Honourable,

"I have given a Meeting at Maynouth, whose Relation is, That great Preparations are now in Agitation at Kilkenny, against your Honour and Party; and that Preston and Owen Roe have agreed; and that their Intention is, to fall on your Army so soon as it shall march; that Two Thousand Horse and Dragooners are to be this next Week in Readiness to come into your Honour's Quarters, only to destroy and ruin; and that the Lord of Inchiquin was on Sunday last at Kilkenny, and Propositions are between Ormond and the Irish Council: But he doth absolutely assure me, that they all join against your Honour and Party, whom God I trust, will ever as hitherto favour and defend. If it be your Honour's Pleasure, he will go to Kilkenny this next Week, and within Ten Days give your Honour an Account of all Things; which I thought fit to acquaint your Honour withal, and will ever rest

"Your Honour's

Maynouth, this 20th of October, 1648.

"Most humble Servant."

Letter to the Commissioners with the King, to acquaint Him with the preceding Letters.

"My Lords and Gentlemen,

"The Houses of Parliament, having received a Dispatch out of Ireland, importing the Lord of Ormond's arriving in that Kingdom, qualified with a Power to treat and conclude a Peace with the Rebels there, have judged it so contrary to an Act of this present Parliament, and so destructive to a speedy and effectual Reducement of the Irish, that they have ordered Copies of the Letters received by them to be sent to you, with Power to acquaint the King with them, and to desire His Majesty's Public Declaration against any such Power, and against the Proceedings of the said Lord of Ormond. Which being all we have in Command, we remain

"Your Lordship's

Westm'r, Octobr., 1648.

"Humble Servants."

King's Answer about abolishing Bishops not satisfactory.

"Resolved by the Lords and Commons in Parliament assembled,

"That His Majesty's Answer to that Part of the Proposition that concerns a Bill and Ordinances for the abolishing of Bishops, is not satisfactory."

Williamson versus Compton.

Ordered, That the Cause between Jo. Williamson & al. Plaintiffs, (fn. 3) and Dorothy Compton Defendant, in a Writ of Error depending in this House, shall be argued, at this Bar, on the 12th Day of December next, at Ten of the Clock: All Parties to have Notice, and to attend.

Affidavit of Grigg's & al. Contempt of the Order for attaching Conisby.

"Mathew Hassall maketh Oath, That, by virtue of an Order from the Honourable House of Lords, bearing Date the 18th of October, 1648, he attached the Body of Thomas Conisby Esquire, the Twentieth Day of the said Month; whereupon, this Deponent having the said Thomas Conisby Esquire in Custody at the said Thomas Conisby's House, one Thomas Grigg, Constable of the same Parish, did undertake, Body for Body, that he should be forthcoming upon Demand, when this Deponent would call for him; wherein the aforesaid Thomas Grigge failed. Further this Deponent maketh Oath, That he went in Danger of his Life by Thomas James and John Robbins, in the Presence of the aforesaid Constable Thomas Grigge; and this Deponent could not get him, although he shewed him the Order to raise any Assistance whatsoever towards the Execution of the said Order.

"Mathew Hassall.

"Jur. 27 Die Octobr. 1648.

"E. Leeche."