21st May 1624

FRIDAY, 21 MAY 1624

I. JOURNAL OF THE HOUSE OF COMMONS, PA, HC/CL/JO/1/14

[CJ 708; f. 48]

Venerii, 21⁰ Maii, 22⁰ Jacobi

[William] Clarke, a servant to Robert Hall, brought to the bar and kneeling, was charged by MR. SPEAKER with serving an order and a process upon Sir Robert Brooke, a member of the House, at the Commons' House door. Says he was commanded by his master to do it, and was ignorant of the privileges of this House.

Resolved, to leave him in the custody of the Serjeant until the House take further order, and his master to be sent for again by the former warrant by the Serjeant.

MR. [JOHN] GLANVILLE reports from the committee for privileges, first, for Cirencester in Gloucestershire against Sir William Master, returned, and Sir Maurice Berkeley, unduly omitted. After full hearing, 4 points resolved. Firstly, that no consent of parties, competitors can alter the legal course of election. Secondly, [William] Bird cleared from any undue course. Thirdly, that where no custom or charter to the contrary, the election to be made by all the householders. Fourthly, that Sir William Master duly elected. That Sir William Master had the greater number of inhabitants and freeholders.

[f. 48v] Bird, being [under-]sheriff of the county and being present and used by the bailiff as his clerk, this thought no misdemeanour, nor he any intruder.

Upon question, no consent of any competitor in any election can alter the legal course of election.

For Bird, the House resolved to leave him, and neither to clear him nor censure him.

Upon a second question, in a borough not being a corporation, there being here no free burgesses nor charter nor custom for election, the election to be made by the householders and not only by freeholders.

Upon a 3rd question, Sir William Master duly elected and returned.

L. 3a. An act for grant of 3 entire subsidies and of 3 fifteens and tenths by the temporalty.

Upon question, passed.

Sir Ranulphe Crewe and Mr. Attorney General bring from the Lords a message for a conference about the recusants with the same committee that conferred yesterday. This to be in the Painted Chamber presently if the conveniency of this House will suffer.

Battle bill and brewhouses and Apothecaries in the Exchequer Chamber tomorrow, 2 [o']clock, afternoon. And Mr. Solicitor added to the committee for brewers.

Answer sent by the same messengers that we will meet presently to confer.

Mr. Solicitor to make the report.

The committee for secret offices to meet this afternoon.

The intimation against the Lord Bishop of Norwich ordered yesterday in [Simon] Dormer's business to be omitted.

MR. [JOHN] CARVILE reports from the committee for keeping the castle of York that they held it against law and very mischievous to the subject. For 14⁰ Ed. 3 it is recited that gaols belonged to the sheriffs. 13⁰ R. 2, 19⁰ H. 7. And by all these 3 statutes these grants void of keeping of gaols. Mitton's case, 39 et 40⁰ Eliz. such a grant resolved void. Agreed by the counsel on the other part that grants of gaols void; but the king might grant the keeping of his [f. 51] castle to any, and the sheriff was bound to provide a gaol for his prisoners. But this the committee held otherwise, and that it was mischievous to the sheriff, chargeable for escapes and to the subjects for losing their debts.

So was also the grant for Lancashire gaol, which in many parts was worse than the other.

MR. SOLICITOR reported from the conference that Lord Archbishop, that the Lords [sic] thanked us for our correspondence from the beginning of the Parliament hitherto, and that they desire the continuance. That they allow the manner [sic] of the petition; but for the manner, they going upon oath and having now [sic] time to examine, they saw not how they could prefer them unheard. That they thought fit the Prince should acquaint the King with this, and that the Prince would undertake it if the House so thought fit.

Resolved, to accept of the Prince's offer; and Mr. Solicitor sent to signify so much to the Lords with thanks to the Prince.

Serjeant [Sir John] Davies and Serjeant [Sir Henry] Finch bring from the Lords:

• 1. The act for continuance of statutes.
• 2. Concealments.
• 3. Removing actions out of inferior courts.
• [4.] And of 3 lectures, with alterations and amendments.

With significations they have sent these down suddenly, they conceiving them to be bills of weight.

Tomorrow, 8 [o']clock, for these bills.

MR. SOLICITOR reports the Prince has accepted the [blank] and will perform it.

[f. 49] Venerii, 21⁰ Maii, 22⁰ Jacobi, post meridiem, [committee of grievances]

Mr. [William] Hakewill. That Mr. [George] Mole, a projector, drew by threats men to come into the company and promised them their money again if the patent held not. That Mr. Mole has compounded with some of these men.

Serjeant [Thomas] Hetley disclaims in the patent of 13⁰ Jacobi and justifies the patent 15⁰ Jacobi.

Fining in the Star Chamber, upon proclamation, a general grievance. The Attorney General sending his pursuivant for men and then referring them over to Sir R[ichard] Lydall. These 2 a general grievance. Agreed the £75 shall be restored by Sir John Fowles's [?examination].

Upon question, the proclamation a grievance in the creation and execution.

Upon a second question, the last patent a grievance in the execution.

Upon a 3rd question, the committee thinks fit in their opinion that restitution be made to all the parties grieved by this patent or proclamation, the restitution to be made by everyone for so [?reach] as he has received to his own use.

Resolved to let the [illegible] above [?here] Monday.

Upon question, the Attorney General sending pursuivants for men and then referring them over to Sir Richard Lydall a great and general grievance.

Upon question, all bonds [2 words illegible] in this case are in the opinion of the committee fit to be cancelled.

[House adjourned]

II. JOURNAL OF THE HOUSE OF COMMONS, PA, HC/CL/JO/1/13

[CJ 792; f. 209v]

Veneris, 21 Maii 1624

William Clarke, that served a subpoena on Sir Robert Brooke, a member of the House, called in. Says he is but a servant to Mr. [Robert] Hall, did not know that it was any offence, did not know he was a member of the House.

This Clarke to remain in the custody of the Serjeant, and a warrant to go for his master, Hall.

MR. [JOHN] GLANVILLE reports from the committee of privileges for Cirencester in Gloucestershire. Against Sir William Master, a petition of divers inhabitants for Sir Maurice Berkeley. Resolved 4 points:

• 1. That there being a consent of competitors, it could not alter the law.
• 2. [William] Bird had not mis-demeaned himself.
• 3. That in this borough, all [f. 210] the inhabitants householders ought to have voice.
• 4. That Sir William Master duly returned. Had most freeholders and inhabitants.

Resolved, upon question, that no consent among competitors can alter the law and custom of elections.

Upon a 2nd question, that where no custom nor charter for election, there the inhabitants householders ought to make election.

Resolved, upon a 3rd question, that Sir William Master is well and duly elected a burgess for Cirencester.

L. 3. An act for the grant of 3 entire subsidies and 3 fifteens and tenths granted by the temporalty.

Upon question, passed.

A message from the Lords by Serjeant [Sir Ranulphe] Crewe and Mr. Attorney General. The Lords desire a present conference with this House with the same committee that met their Lordships yesterday concerning recusants, if it may stand with the conveniency of this House.

Answer: this House will give a present meeting at the conference as is desired.

Brewers' bill and bill of battle, tomorrow afternoon, Exchequer Chamber. Mr. Solicitor added.

Apothecaries' bill the same time.

[f. 210v] MR. SOLICITOR reports from the Lords. Had this answer by the Archbishop of Canterbury. They have taken into consideration the petition we preferred yesterday to them concerning recusants, the matter whereof they do exceedingly well approve. But for the manner of it, desired us to consider the manner of their proceeding, which is always upon oath, for which now they have not time, and to present them without examination not fitting. But had thought of this course: to desire the Prince his Highness to acquaint the King privately with it as a matter of state. Prince said if we did desire it, he would be willing to undertake it.

Mr. Solicitor to return thanks unto the Prince and the Lords, and to accept of this offer.

A message from the Lords by Serjeant [Sir John] Davies and Serjeant [Sir Henry] Finch. The Lords have returned to this House 4 bills, with amendments.

• 1. Continuance of statutes.
• 2. Concealments.
• 3. Inferior courts.
• 4. 3 lectures in divinity.

And signify thus much, that they make the more haste in sending these bills because we may have time to pass them, being bills of great importance.

These amendments to be read tomorrow at 8 [o']clock.

[House adjourned]

III. DIARY OF JOHN HAWARDE, WILTSHIRE AND SWINDON ARCHIVES, 9/34/2

[p. 296]

Vendredis, 21 Maii 1624

Bill of subsidies reade and, sur le question, passed.

Conference ove les seignours sur message al eux touchante transmittante recusants en office et authoritie deste remoove hors de touts commissions. The Prince undertooke to doe it.

Bill pur repeales et contynewances de statutes retorne del seignours ove amendmentes sur statute de E.6 pur retaile de vines.

Conference sur ces, puis long debate, reservante le grante al Count de Nottingham pur sa vie.

IV. DIARY OF EDWARD NICHOLAS, TNA, SP 14/166

[f. 214]

Friday, 21⁰ Maii 1624

It is resolved, on the question, in the case of Sir William Master, elected burgess for Cirencester, that where there is no custom nor charter of corporation to the contrary, there all the inhabitants householders shall have voice in the election of burgesses and not the freeholders only of such town.

An act for the granting of 3 entire subsidies and 3 fifteens and tenths granted by the temporalty. 3. L. This bill is now passed this House, no voice contradicting it. r. p.

[f. 214v] Message from the Lords signifying that their Lordships desire a present conference between committees of this House and that of their Lordships concerning our petition and certificate against such recusants as hold any place in the kingdom of trust.

Our answer: that we will give a present meeting in the Painted Chamber as is desired.

MR. SOLICITOR reports from the conference that the Lord of Canterbury signified that the Lords did give us thanks for our good correspondency with them. That their Lordships approve and commend the matter of our petition, but the manner of it they doubt of, for their Lordships' proceeding in all points of judicature was on oath and the proceeding in this petition was in a kind of judicature, and if their Lordships should now prefer this certificate against such recusants as we have presented in that petition that then might those recusants justly say they were condemned unheard by their Lordships. But the Parliament being so near an end, their Lordships have desired the Prince to be pleased to present the same to the King as from both Houses, whereto his Highness is willing and said if we shall desire him, he will present the same to his father. That his Highness stays to hear answer hereto, and the Lords conceive this course to be the best way now to affect our desires.

Ordered, that Mr. Solicitor shall [f. 215] from this House deliver his Highness our humble thanks that he will be pleased on the behalf of us and the Lords to present that our petition to his Majesty.

MR. SOLICITOR, from the Prince, reports that his Highness seems very willing to embrace our desire and to do us therein all good offices, and said he doubted not but to affect our desire therein.

At the committee, 21⁰ Maii 1624, concerning the Earl of Middlesex's bill

It was debated and allowed that though the Earl of Middlesex's land should by this act be made liable to the payment of his debts and that the King should not extend for his fine until all debts were paid, yet no subject can extend until that he has a judgement, and he can have no judgement unless his Lordship will appear to his suit, for if his Lordship suffer himself to be outlawed the forfeiture thereof comes to the King, and his creditors shall be never the better for it, so as this act touching the making of his Lordship's lands liable to the payment of his debts (which is the chief thing we desire by this bill) will be fruitless. And if we shall (as some would have it) by this act make all his debts to be recoverable as if his creditors had a judgement, then there would be a question and strife which of his creditors should have priority to extend.

It was by this committee resolved that Mr. Solicitor should call to him Mr. [John] Selden and other lawyers of our House, and consider if they could make this bill good by any reasonable amendments; if not, that then report should be made of it to the House that a [f. 215v] conference might be had with the Lords concerning the drawing of a new bill that might reach there. That we desire, which is chiefly the relief of his Lordship's creditors, for the King has long and many hands to help his Majesty to come by his fine.

V. DIARY OF SIR WALTER EARLE, BL, ADD. MS 18,597

[f. 187]

Friday, the 21st of May

[f. 187v] The committee for viewing all the petitions delivered to the general committees of grievances, trade and courts of justice, in the Court of Wards.

Courts of justice

14 April

The House sitting

Sir Robert Brooke having complained of being served with process out of Chancery at the door at the suit of one [Robert] Hall, the party that served him was called in and committed to the Serjeant [f. 188v] until Hall his master came in, that so they might both be censured.

MR. [JOHN] GLANVILLE'S report from the committee of privileges. The case of Cirencester.

Resolved, upon the question:

• 1. That the agreement of competitors or others could not restrain the election to freeholders or etc.
• 2. That Sir William Master's election was good.

The bill of subsidies thirdly read, passed.

A message from the Lords. They crave a present conference touching the business of recusants yesterday handled. That in regard the Lords used in such judicial courses to proceed upon oath in examining particulars and hearing men's answers, which now they could not do in so short a space, therefore they thought it the fittest course (if we liked it) to move the Prince that he would in private acquaint the King as with a matter of state, the Prince being ready to undertake it. The Prince showed he was ready to undertake it.

The House resolved, by the question, to accept this offer and to thank the Prince.

4 bills sent down, with amendments:

• 1. The bill of continuance of statutes.
• 2. The bill touching concealments.
• 3. Against vexatious suits.

Friday afternoon, the committee of grievances

Sir Edward Coke related what petitions had been brought in besides the 8 already passed the censure: [f. 189] Staplers; Parker's complaint Star Chamber velam [sic]; seacoal; Carpenters; glasses; soap; fishing in Ireland: transporting of sheepskins; 4d. per quarter of malt; Dungeness lights; [Barber-]Surgeons; white starch; smalt or blue starch; Gardeners; French company; earth for tobacco pipes; printing songs and hymns; brokers; Bargrave; postmasters; Auditor [Francis] Curle; hostmen of Newcastle; Dr. Chambers' patent; the Lady Boteler's complaint.

The complaint against the Staplers heard. [George] Mole and [Arthur] Kynaston accused to have been projectors and executioners of the patent complained of. The charge:

• 1. That they were projectors and procurers of the patent.
• 2. That they served with writs and threatened many poor people.

Their answer:

• 1. They justified the patent by law. They were enforced to accept it to free themselves from molestation of the Lord Fentoun.
• 2. They denied the serving of writs but laid it upon Gwin and [Sir Richard] Lydall.

Upon debate and question, resolved:

• 1. The proclamation a grievance.
• 2. That restitution be made to the complainants by such as had received any money to their own use, otherwise the Lord Fentoun, etc., to be transmitted.

VI. JOURNAL OF SIR SIMONDS D'EWES, BL, HARL. MS 159

[f. 119]

May 21, Friday

A collection of 10s. for a knight of the shire and [f. 119v] 5s. for every burgess to be bestowed upon the officers that had attended in several places at committees, etc.

The election of Chichester [sic] questioned and confirmed.

The bill of subsidies had the last reading.