House of Lords Journal Volume 64: 30 July 1832

Die Lunæ, 30° Julii 1832.

DOMINI tam Spirituales quam Temporales præsentes fuerunt:

PRAYERS.

The Earl of Shaftesbury sat Speaker by virtue of a former Commission.

Lawson v. A. & P. Ogilvy, Appellant's Petition for Time for Time for his Case, referred to Appeal Com ee.

Upon reading the Petition of James Lawson, Appellant in a Cause depending in this House, to which Mrs. Anna Wedderburn Ogilvy and Peter Wedderburn Ogilvy her Husband are Respondents; praying, "That their Lordships will be pleased to grant him such reasonable Time for preparing and lodging his Case as to their Lordships may seem proper under the Circumstances therein mentioned:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition be referred to the Appeal Committee.

Butt to enter into a Recogce on Ewing's Appeal.

The House being moved, "That John Butt of Great College Street, Westminster, Gentleman, may be permitted to enter into a Recognizance for William Ewing Esquire, on account of his Appeal depending in this House, he residing in Scotland:"

The same was agreed to; and Ordered accordingly.

Richardson to enter into a Recogce on Beveridge's Appeal.

The House being moved, "That John Richardson of Fludyer Street, Westminster, Gentleman, may be permitted to enter into a Recognizance for Alexander Beveridge Esquire, on account of his Appeal depending in this House, he being in Scotland:"

The same was agreed to; and Ordered accordingly.

Education, (Ireland,) Petitions in favor of proposed Plan:

Upon reading the Petition of the Protestant Dissenters of the Independent Persuasion assembling in Bethesda Chapel, Liverpool, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships, "That the Government Plan of Education in Ireland may be carried into full Effect:"

(Bethesda Chapel, Liverpool:)

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Great George Street Chapel, Liverpool:

Upon reading the Petition of the Protestant Dissenters of the Independent or Congregational Denomination assembling in Great George Street Chapel, Liverpool, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships "to persevere in the Course upon which they have entered, and to give the Plan of Education lately brought forward under the Sanction of the Irish Government the Benefit of a full and impartial Trial:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Castletown Delvin, &c.

Upon reading the Petition of the Inhabitants of the United Parishes of Castletown Delvin, and Killulagh, in the County Westmeath, Ireland, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships, "That the Measure of a liberal and united National Education for Ireland, so fraught with incalculable National Advantages, may with all convenient Speed be passed into a Legislative Enactment:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Customs Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act to amend the Laws relating to the Customs;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

The said Bill was read the First Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be printed.

Ecclesiastical Corporation Lands Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

To return the Bill, intituled, "An Act to authorize the identifying of Lands and other Possessions of certain Ecclesiastical and Collegiate Corporations;" and to acquaint this House, That they have agreed to the same, with some Amendments, to which they desire their Lordships Concurrence.

Sewers Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act to amend the Laws relating to Sewers;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

The said Bill was read the First Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be printed.

Post Roads (Ireland) Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act to amend an Act of the Forty-fifth Year of His Majesty King George the Third, relating to Post Roads in Ireland;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

The said Bill was read the First Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be printed.

Registry of Deeds (Ireland) Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act to regulate the Office for registering Deeds, Conveyances and Wills in Ireland;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

The said Bill was read the First Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be printed.

Reform (Ireland) Bill, 2 Petitions from Galway for Alteration of

Upon reading the Petition of the Inhabitants of Galway, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; taking notice of a Bill depending in this House, intituled, "An Act to amend the Representation of the People of Ireland;" and praying, "That their Lordships will be pleased to place the Rights of all resident Merchants, Tradesmen and Artisans of Galway, elected to Freedom prior to the Enactment of the said Bill, upon an Equality with those of the Forty Shilling Freeholders; and that their Lordships will be also pleased to equalize and assimilate the Registration to all Classes of the Constituency, by obliging the Forty Shilling Freeholders to register anew, without any Regard whatever to the former defective Mode of Registration:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Upon reading the Petition of the resident Magistrates of Galway, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; taking notice of the last-mentioned Bill, and praying their Lordships "to alter the Twenty-first and Twenty-second Clauses of the same, so as to extend the same Mode of Registry to all Classes of the Constituency, by annulling the Registration, Certificate and Proceedings before Magistrates in the former defective State of the Law; and that the Petitioners may be heard by Counsel at their Lordships Bar against said Inequality in the Mode of Registry, as projected in the said Bill:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Reform (Ireland) Bill, Petition from Westmeath against.

Upon reading the Petition of the Noblemen, Gentry and Clergy of the County of Westmeath, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; taking notice of the last-mentioned Bill, and praying their Lordships, "That the same may not pass into a Law:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Tithes & Church Rates, (Ireland,) Petitions for Abolition of: (Cove & Great Island:)

Upon reading the Petition of the Inhabitants of Cove and the Great Island, in the County of Cork, adopted at a Public Meeting, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships "to abolish the Laws imposing Tithes and Church Rates in Ireland, not only in Name but in Reality, and for ever:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Ballyhea, &c:

Upon reading the Petition of the Inhabitants and Landholders of the Parishes of Ballyhea, Ardskeagh, Aglishdrideen, Cooline and Emphrick, in the County of Cork, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships, "in Compliance with the unanimous Voice of the Nation, to consent to the total Abolition of Tithes and Church Rates in Ireland:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Persons subscribing.

Upon reading the Petition of the Persons whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships "for a speedy and effectual Relief from Tithes and Church Rates:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Tithes, (Ireland,) Petitions for Abolition of: (Mourne Abbey & Grenagh:)

Upon reading the Petition of the Inhabitants of the Parishes of Mourne Abbey and Grenagh, County of Cork, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships "to abolish Tithes in Ireland, and to permit each Sect to support its own Minister, by which alone the best Interests of the Kingdom will be consolidated, and Peace and Prosperity will be restored to that hitherto unhappy and distracted Land:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Killorny:

Upon reading the Petition of the Parishioners and Tithe Payers of the Parish of Killorny, in the County of Kerry, whose Names are thereunto subscribed:

Killshinane:

Also, Upon reading the Petition of the Parishioners and Tithe Payers of the Parish of Killshinane, in the County of Kerry, whose Names are thereunto subscribed:

Dysert:

Also, Upon reading the Petition of the Parishioners and Tithe Payers of the Parish of Dysert, in the County of Kerry, whose Names are thereunto subscribed:

Kilfeighney:

And also, Upon reading the Petition of the Parishioners and Tithe Payers of the Parish of Kilfeighney, in the County of Kerry, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; severally praying their Lordships "to devise a speedy and efficacious Remedy for the Grievances occasioned by the Tithe System in Ireland:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petitions do lie on the Table.

Liscarrol:

Upon reading the Petition of the Tithe Payers of the Parish of Liscarrol, in the Diocess of Cloyne and County of Cork, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships "to take the grievous Injustice of Tithes into their serious Consideration; and to make such Provision for the Support of the Clergy of the Established Church that it may have no Interference whatever with the People:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Lurgan.

Upon reading the Petition of the Freeholders and Landholders of the Parish of Lurgan and County of Cavan, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships "to apply an immediate and effectual Remedy to the disgraceful Evils occasioned by the Exaction of Tithes in Ireland, by supporting the Protestant Clergy out of the Revenue arising from the Church Lands in Ireland, which would be more than adequate to make an ample Provision for the wealthiest Church in the World, and by those Means render Ireland a happy and contented Country, making her what she has been emphatically called by a modern Historian, and what under proper Treatment she will inevitably prove herself to be, the Right Arm of the British Empire:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Tithes & Vestry Laws, (Ireland,) Petition from Kilrane for Abolition of.

Upon reading the Petition of the Tithe Payers of the Parish of Kilrane, in the Barony of Forth and County of Wexford, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praving their Lordships "to accede to the long-neglected Supplications of a wronged but loyal People for a total Abolition of the universally loathed Tithe and Vestry Laws in Ireland:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Mills & Factories, Petition from North Walsham for regulating Hours of Labour in.

Upon reading the Petition of the Inhabitants of North Walsham, in the County of Norfolk, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships, "That the Bill now before the Legislature may be passed into a Law, to restrict the actual working of Children in all the Mills and Factories of the United Kingdom to Ten Hours per Day for Five Days, and Eight on the remaining Day, and to prevent any Child under Nine Years being worked in any Factory or Mill:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Labourers Employment Bill, Petition from Hockering in favor of.

Upon reading the Petition of the Owners and Occupiers of Lands, and others, Inhabitants of the Parish of Hockering, in the Hundred of Milford, in the County of Norfolk, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; taking notice of a Bill depending in this House, intituled, "An Act for the better Employment of Labourers in Agricultural Parishes until the Twenty-fifth Day of March One thousand eight hundred and thirty-four;" and praying their Lordships "to pass the same, with such Modifications as they may deem advisable, and with as little Delay as may be compatible with the Forms of their Lordships Proceedings:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

London Police Bill, Petition of Court of Mayor, &c. of London against, referred to the Com ee.

Upon reading the Petition of the Court of Mayor and Aldermen of the City of London; taking notice of a Bill depending in this House, intituled, "An Act for establishing a Day and Night Police in the City of London;" and praying, "That their Lordships will not pass any Bill which may deprive the Petitioners of the Power they possess over Constables:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition be referred to the Committee to whom the said Bill stands committed.

Ld. Duffus' Claim to vote for Peers for Scotland, referred to Com ee for Privileges.

Upon reading the Petition of The Right Honorable Benjamin Lord Duffus, setting forth, "That James, Second Lord Duffus, had Three Sons, Kenneth, James and William Sutherlands: That Kenneth, the eldest Son, succeeded his Father in the Peerage, and was attainted for Accession to the Rebellion in 1715, but the Title was restored by Act of Parliament passed in the Seventh Year of His late Majesty's Reign, and was enjoyed by the late James Lord Duffus, now deceased, who was the Grandson of Kenneth the attainted Lord: That James Lord Duffus was never married, and the Issue Male of Kenneth the attainted Lord is now extinct: That James, the Second Son of the Second Lord Duffus, married Elizabeth, the only Child and Heiress of Sir William Dunbar of Hempriggs, and in consequence of that Marriage procured from Her Majesty Queen Anne a Charter, in 1706, of Baronetage, by the Name and Title of Sir James Dunbar of Hempriggs: That the said Mr. James Sutherland, then Sir James Dunbar, had Issue William, his eldest Son, who, after his Decease, succeeded to him, and became Sir William Dunbar of Hempriggs: The Petitioner was eldest Son of the said Sir William, and succeeded him by the Title of Sir Benjamin Dunbar of Hempriggs: That the Petitioner is thus the lineal Male Representative of James the Second Baron Duffus, the common Ancestor of the foresaid Kenneth Baron Duffus, who was attainted, and James Sutherland his Brother, afterwards Sir James Dunbar, and as such, and by virtue of the said Act of Restoration, is entitled to the Honor, Dignity and Titles of Baron Duffus: That, as by a Resolution of their Lordships House, of Date the 3d Day of May 1822, the Petitioner is debarred from voting at the Election of any Peer to be chosen to sit and vote in their Lordships House as a Representative Peer of Scotland, until, upon a Claim made to their Lordships, his Right of voting shall have been admitted by their Lordships, it becomes necessary to address this Application to their Lordships;" and therefore praying, That his Right of voting for the Representative Peers of Scotland may be admitted and declared by their Lordships:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition be referred to the Lords Committees for Privileges, to consider and report.

Boundaries (Ireland) Bill.

The Order of the Day being read for the Lords to be summoned;

It was moved, "That the Bill, intituled, "An Act to settle and describe the Limits of Cities, Towns and Boroughs in Ireland, in so far as respects the Election of Members to serve in Parliament," be now read a Second Time."

The Question was put thereupon?

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Then the said Bill was read a Second Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be committed to a Committee of the Whole House.

Ordered, That the House be put into a Committee upon the said Bill To-morrow; and that the Lords be summoned.

Labourers Employment Bill.

The Order of the Day being read for the Lords to be summoned;

It was moved, "That the Bill, intituled, "An Act for the better Employment of Labourers in Agricultural Parishes until the Twenty-fifth Day of March One thousand eight hundred and thirty-four," be now read a Second Time."

Which being objected to;

After short Debate,

The Question was put thereupon?

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Then the said Bill was read a Second Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be committed to a Committee of the Whole House.

Ordered, That the House be put into a Committee upon the said Bill on Friday next; and that the Lords be summoned.

Orders in Council underCholera Prevention Act delivered.

The Lord President laid before the House, pursuant to the Directions of an Act of Parliament;

"Order of the Lords of the Council, dated 9th July 1832, to enable the Board of Health at Newark to raise Sixty Pounds:"

And also, "Order of the Lords of the Council, dated 19th July 1832, for enabling Boards of Health in England to remove Nuisances, procure Burying Grounds, &c."

And the Titles thereof being read by the Clerk;

Ordered, That the said Papers do lie on the Table.

Ordered, That the said Papers be printed.

The House was adjourned during Pleasure.

The House was resumed by The Lord Chancellor.

Reform (Ireland) Bill read 3 a:

The Order of the Day being read for the Third Reading of the Bill, intituled, "An Act to amend the Representation of the People of Ireland;" and for the Lords to be summoned;

It was moved, "That the said Bill be now read the Third Time."

Which being objected to;

The Question was put thereupon?

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Protests thereupon:

"DISSENTIENT:

"Because we look upon the passing this Bill as destructive of the Protestant Interest, and thus endangering the Established Church in Ireland.

"Ernest.

"Wynford.

"Bexley.

"Gascoyne Salisbury."

"DISSENTIENT:

"1st.-Because I think the Irish Reform Bill is unjust in Principle and mischievous in Detail; it deprives Protestant Freemen of their Privileges, and overthrows those Guards for the Protection of Protestantism in Ireland which our Ancestors so wisely established, and by which, under God, the Blessings of Civil and Religious Liberty have been hitherto preserved to all Classes of His Majesty's Subjects.

"2d.-Because it will be the means of destroying the Protestant Church Establishment in Ireland, and erecting in its Place a System of Error and Superstition calculated to enslave the Minds of the People.

"3d.-Because it gives additional Power to Roman Catholic Priests and Demagogues to control the Electors in the Choice of their Representatives, and will thereby ensure a Return to the Commons House of Parliament of those who are opposed to the Influence of Property and the Permanence of British Connexion.

"4th.-Because I think it will lead to a Series of Measures destructive of the best Interests of the Country, and produce Anarchy and Confusion throughout the whole Empire.

"Clanbrassill.

"For 3rd & 4 Reasons-Longford."

"DISSENTIENT:

"Because the Provisions of this Bill appear necessarily to endanger the salutary Effects of those Measures, which, at the Period of the Union between Great Britain and Ireland, were considered such as best tended to strengthen and consolidate the Connection between the Two Kingdoms, and which were adopted in order to promote and secure the essential Interests of both, and to consolidate the Strength, Power and Resources of the British Empire.

"Because the Provisions of this Bill have a Tendency to prejudice the Protestant Interests of the United Kingdom, and to endanger the One Protestant United Episcopal Church of England and Ireland, the Continuance and Preservation of which has been declared to be an essential and fundamental Part of the Union.

"Eldon.

Longford.

West Meath.

Redesdale."

Then the said Bill was read the Third Time.

Then it was moved, in Press 8, Line 8, "after ("aforesaid") to insert the following Clause:

"Provided nevertheless, and be it enacted, That notwithstanding any thing herein-before contained, no Person shall be entitled to vote in the Election of a Member or Members to serve in any future Parliament for any City or Town, or County of a City or Town, in respect of any Estate or Interest in any Freehold which shall have been acquired by such Person since the First Day of March One thousand eight hundred and thirty-one, unless the same shall have come to or been acquired by such Person since that Day and previously to the passing of this Act by Descent, Succession, Marriage, Marriage Settlement, Devise, or Promotion to any Benefice in a Church, or by Promotion to any Office."

The same was agreed to; and Ordered accordingly.

Then the following Amendments were made to the said Bill:

Pr. 8. L. 15. & L. 16. Leave out from ("Persons") to ("who") in Line 17.

L. 19. After ("be") insert ("at any Time hereafter")

L. 33. After ("been") insert ("or hereafter shall be")

Then it was moved, in Clause B. added to the Bill by way of Rider, Lines 11 and 12, "to leave out ("if required by such Barrister")

Which being objected to;

The Question was put, "Whether the Words proposed to be left out shall stand Part of the Bill?"

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Then the following Amendments were made to the said Bill:

Pr. 18. L. ult. In Clause B. added to the Bill by way of Rider:

L. 12. After ("the") insert ("Nature and") L. penult. After ("shall") insert ("upon such Proof being made, and also Proof of Identity")

Pr. 32. L. 32. After ("Pounds") insert ("and for every Clergyman who claims to vote as a Freeholder in Right of his Benefice")

Then it was moved, in Press 60, Line 36, in Schedule O. No. 6, annexed to the Bill, "after ("of,") to insert ("and that a solvent and responsible Tenant could, as I verily believe, afford to pay for the same as an additional Rent, fairly and without Collusion, the Annual Sum of Ten Pounds over and above all the Rent to which I am liable in respect thereof")

Which being objected to;

The Question was put, "Whether the said Words shall be there inserted?"

It was resolved in the Negative.

Bill passed:

Then the Question was put, "Whether this Bill, with the Amendments, shall pass?"

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Message to H.C. with Amendments to it.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Giffin Wilson and Mr. Martin;

To return the said Bill, and acquaint them, That the Lords have agreed to the same, with several Amendments, to which their Lordships desire their Concurrence.

Russian Dutch Loan Bill.

The Order of the Day being read for the Lords to be summoned;

It was moved, "That the Bill, intituled, "An Act to enable His Majesty to carry into Effect a Convention made between His said Majesty and The Emperor of all the Russias," be now read a Second Time."

Which being objected to;

After Debate,

The Question was put thereupon?

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Then the said Bill was read a Second Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be committed to a Committee of the Whole House.

Ordered, That the House be put into a Committee upon the said Bill To-morrow; and that the Lords be summoned.

Militia Pay Bill:

The Order of the Day being read for the Third Reading of the Bill, intituled, "An Act to defray the Charge of the Pay, Clothing, and contingent and other Expences of the Disembodied Militia in Great Britain and Ireland; and to grant Allowances, in certain Cases, to Subaltern Officers, Adjutants, Paymasters, Quartermasters, Surgeons, Assistant Surgeons, Surgeons Mates and Serjeant Majors of the Militia, until the First Day of July One thousand eight hundred and thirtythree;"

The said Bill was accordingly read the Third Time.

The Question was put, "Whether this Bill shall pass?"

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Arms, &c. (Ireland) Bill:

The Order of the Day being read for the Third Reading of the Bill, intituled, "An Act to continue for One Year, and from thence to the End of the then next Session of Parliament, several Acts relating to the Importation and keeping of Arms and Gunpowder in Ireland;"

The said Bill was accordingly read the Third Time.

The Question was put, "Whether this Bill shall pass?"

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Messages to H.C. that the Lords have agreed to the 2 preceding Bills.

And Messages were, severally, sent to the House of Commons, by the former Messengers;

To acquaint them, That the Lords have agreed to the said Bills, without any Amendment.

Taxed Carts Bill.

Hodie 2^a vice lecta est Billa, intituled, "An Act to reduce the Duties now payable in certain Cases on Carriages with less than Four Wheels."

Ordered, That the said Bill be committed to a Committee of the Whole House.

Ordered, That the House be put into a Committee upon the said Bill To-morrow.

Prisoners Removal (Ireland) Bill.

Hodie 2^a vice lecta est Billa, intituled, "An Act to authorize for One Year the Removal of Prisoners from the several Gaols in Ireland in Cases of epidemic Diseases."

Ordered, That the said Bill be committed to a Committee of the Whole House.

Ordered, That the House be put into a Committee upon the said Bill To-morrow.

Adjourn.

Dominus Cancellarius declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque ad et in diem Martis, tricesimum primum diem instantis Julii, horâ undecimâ Auroræ, Dominis sic decernentibus.