House of Lords Journal Volume 4: 16 April 1642

DIE Sabbati, videlicet, 16 die Aprilis.

PRAYERS.

E. of Bolingbroke excused.

The Earl of Bollingbrooke is excused for being absent this Day, in regard of his ill Health.

Rebecca Owen versus Pulford.

Upon reading the Petition of Rebecca Owen, Wife of George Owen; it is Ordered, That John Pulford, now in Imprisonment upon Execution at the Suit of the said George Owen, shall not be released of his Imprisonment until Satisfaction be given, or the Pleasure of this House further signified.

Directed "To the Sheriffs of the City of London, and the Secondaries of both Compters."

The Lord Keeper acquainted the House, "That he hath received a Letter from the King, wherein is inclosed a Message, which he is commanded to communicate to the Houses of Parliament, being in Answer to the Petition of both Houses concerning the removing the Magazine at Hull to The Tower of London, and touching the Six Priests condemned."

The Message was commanded to be read; which was accordingly done, in hæc verba: videlicet,

Message from the King, about removing the Magazine from Hull to The Tower of London, and about the Six condemned Priests.

"We rather expected (and have done so long) that you should have given Us an Account why a Garrison hath been placed in Our Town of Hull without Our Consent, and Soldiers billeted there against Law, and express Words of the Petition of Right, than to be moved (for the avoiding of a needless Charge you have put on yourselves) to give Our Consent for Removal of Our Magazine and Munition (Our own proper Goods), upon such general Reasons as indeed give no Satisfaction to Our Judgement. And, since ye have made the Business of Hull your Argument, We would gladly be informed, why Our own Inclination (on the general Rumour of the Designs of Papists in the Northern Parts) was not thought sufficient Ground for Us to put a Person of Honour, Fortune, and unblemished Reputation, into a Town and Fort of Our own, where Our own Magazine lay; and yet the same Rumour be Warrant enought for you to commit the same Town and Fort (without Our Consent) to the Hands of Sir John Hotham, with a Power unagreeable to the Law of the Land, or the Liberty of the Subject. And yet of this, in Point of Right or Privilege (for sure We are not without Privilege too), We have not all this while complained. And being confident that that Place (whatsoever Discourse there is of public or private Instructions to the contrary) shall be speedily given up, if We shall require it; We shall be contented to dispose Our Munition there (as We have done in other Places), for the public Ease and Benefit, as upon particular Advice We shall find convenient; though We cannot think it fit, or consent, that the whole Magazine be removed together. But, when you shall agree upon such Propositions as shall be held necessary for any particular Service, We shall sign such Warrants as shall be agreeable to Wisdom and Reason; and, if any of them be designed for Ulster or Lempster, you know well the Conveyance will be more easy and convenient from the Place they now are in: Yet We must tell you, that, if the Fears are so great from the Papists at Home, or of Foreign Force (as is pretended), it seems strange that you make not Provision of Arms and Munition for Defence of this Kingdom, rather than seek to carry any more from hence, without some Course taken for Supply; especially if you remember your Engagement to Our Scotts Subjects for that Proportion of Arms which is contained in Your Treaty: We speak not this as not thinking the sending of Arms to Ireland very necessary, but only for the Way of Provision; for you know what great Quantities We have assigned out of Our several Stores, which in due Time We hope you will see replenished. For the Charge of looking to the Magazine at Hull, as it was undertaken voluntarily by you at first, and (to say no more) unnecessarily, so you may free Our good People of that Charge, and leave to Us to look to, who are the proper Owner of it.

"And this, We hope, will give you full Satisfaction in this Point; and that ye do not (as ye have done in the Business of the Militia) send this Message out of complimental Ceremony, resolving to be your own Carvers at last; for We must tell you, if any Attempt or Direction shall be made or given in this Matter, without Our Consent or Approbation, We shall esteem it as an Act of Violence against Us, and declare it to all the World as the greatest Violation of Our Right, and Breach of Our Privilege.

"Concerning the Six Priests condemned; it is true, they were reprieved by Our Warrant, being informed that they were (by some Restraint) disabled to take the Benefit of Our former Proclamation; since that, We have issued out another for the due Execution of Laws against Papists, and have most solemnly promised, in the Word of a King, never to pardon any Priest (without your Consent) which shall be found guilty by Law; desiring to banish these, having herewith sent Warrants to that Purpose, if, upon Second Thoughts, ye do not disapprove thereof: But, if you think the Execution of these Persons so very necessary to the great and pious Work of Reformation, We refer it wholly to you; declaring hereby, that, upon such your Resolution signified to the Ministers of Justice, Our Warrant for their Reprieve is determined, and the Law to have the Course.

"And now let Us ask you (for We are willing to husband Time, and to dispatch as much may be under One Message; God knows the Distractions of this Kingdom want a present Remedy!), will there never be a Time to offer to, as well as to ask of, Us? We will propose no more Particulars to you, having no Luck to please, or be understood by you: Take your own Time for what concerns Our Particular; but be sure ye have an early, speedy Care of the Public; [ (fn. 1) that is,] of the only Rule which preserves the Public, the Law of the Land: Preserve the Dignity and Reverence due to that. It was well said, in a Speech made by a private Person, but published by Order of the House of Commons this Parliament, (fn. 2) The Law is that which puts a Difference betwixt Good and Evil, betwixt just and unjust: If you take away the Law, all Things will fall into a Confusion; every Man will become a Law unto himself, which, in the depraved Condition of human Nature, must needs produce many great Enormities: Lust will become a Law, and Envy will become a Law; Covetousness and Ambition will become Laws; and what Dictates, what Decisions, such Laws will produce, may easily be discerned. So said that Gentleman, and much more, very well, in Defence of the Law, and against arbitrary Power: It is worth looking over, and considering. And, if the most zealous Defence of true Protestant Profession, and the most resolved Protection of the Law, be the most necessary Duty of a Prince, We cannot believe this miserable Distance and Misunderstanding can be long continued between Us; We having often and earnestly declared them to be (fn. 3) the chiefest Desires of Our Soul, and the End and Rule of all Our Actions.

"For Ireland; We have sufficiently, and We hope satisfactorily, expressed to all Our good Subjects Our hearty Sense of that sad Business, in Our several Messages in that Argument, but especially in Our last of the Eighth of this Month, concerning Our Resolution for that Service; for the speedy, honourable and full Performance whereof, We conjure you to yield all possible Assistance and present Advice."

To be communicated to the H. C.

This Message being read; the House Resolved, To communicate the same to the House of Commons.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Mr. Justice Foster and Justice Heath:

Message to the H. C. for a Conference upon it.

To desire a present Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, in the Painted Chamber, if it may stand with their Conveniency, touching a Message received from the King, of a dangerous Consequence.

Committee to prepare Heads for the Conference.

Then the House appointed these Lords following, to consider and draw up what Heads is fit to be communicated to the House of Commons at this Conference, and report the same to the House:

Their Lordships withdrew presently into the Prince's Lodgings.

Ordered, That Mr. Steward's Cause shall be heard before the Lords Committees for Petitions, on Tuesday next, in the Afternoon, in the Painted Chamber; at which Time the Parties and Witnesses on both Sides are to attend.

The Messengers that were sent to the House of Commons return with this Answer:

Answer from the H. C.

That they will give a present Meeting, in the Painted Chamber, as is desired.

Next, the Lord Admiral reported the Draught of the Heads of the Conference prepared by the Committee; which were read, as follows:

Report from the Committee of the Heads for the Conference.

"To let the House of Commons know, that this House is Resolved, That it is necessary that the Magazine be removed from Hull, to The Tower of London; because they believe that those evil Counsellors who advised this Answer (wherein there is a Threatening to the Parliament, and an unjust Charge of Violation of the Laws) have a Design to stay those Arms there, that they may be made Use of to the Disturbance of the Peace of the Kingdom; and therefore they do conclude that those who have advised the King to make this Answer to the Parliament are such as do seek the Ruin and Subversion of the Kingdom: And further to desire, that a Committee of both Houses may be chosen, to draw up the Reasons which did induce the Houses to desire the Removal of the Arms from Hull to London; resolving to publish them, with their Petition to the King, and His Answer to it."

Ordered, That this House approves of these Heads; and that the same be delivered, at this Conference, to the House of Commons.

Then this House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed.

Committee to join one of, the H. C. to draw up the Reasons which induced the Houses to desire the Magazine might be removed from Hull to The Tower.

And the House nominated these Lords following to be Committees, to join with a proportionable Number of the House of Commons, to draw up the Reasons which induced the Houses to desire the removing of the Magazine and Arms from Hull to London: videlicet,

Their Lordships, or any Five, to meet this Afternoon, at Two of the Clock, in the Painted Chamber.

Message to the H. C. to acquaint them with this.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Dr. Bennett:

To let them know, that, according to the Proposition now at the Conference, this House hath appointed a Committee of Thirteen Lords, to meet with a proportionable Number of their House, this Afternoon, at Two of the Clock, in the Painted Chamber.

Lord Newnham, discharged of his Embassage to Venice by the King, prays his Case may be taken into Consideration.

The Lord Newnham acquainted this House, "That the King hath discharged him of his Employment as Ambassador at Venice; whereby he is disabled to perform that Service, which, both by their Lordships Desires to the King, and His Majesty's Consent, signified to their Lordships, and to the State of Venice by Letter, he was engaged to return to that State, to satisfy them for the opening of their Letters:" He further signified, "That he hath a great Family there, and an Agent in his Absence; but, for Want of Monies which are owing to him by the King, he is not able to bring his Family back, and discharge it, by reason he hath not been paid his Arrears from the King, which hath forced him to engage his Estate here for Two Years; and desired their Lordships to take his Case into Consideration." Hereupon this House Ordered, To take this Business into Consideration on Monday Morning next, as a special Business.

Bill for regulating the Militia in England and Wales.

Hodie 1^a et 2^a vice lecta est Billa, An Act for the Ordering of the Militia of England, and the Dominion of Wales.

Ordered, To be committed to the Committee of the whole House, and to be taken into Consideration on Tuesday Morning next.

Attorney General's Business.

Ordered, That the Business concerning Mr. Attorney General shall be taken into Consideration on Monday next.

Lord Loftus's Cause.

Ordered, That the Cause of the Lord Viscount Loftus shall be heard on Monday next, in the Afternoon; and then Parties, and Counsel, and Witnesses, on both Sides, are to attend the said Hearing.

Answer from the H. C.

The Messengers return with this Answer from the House of Commons:

That they have appointed a Committee to meet with the Committee of Lords this Afternoon, at the Time prefixed.

Private Petitions and Causes deferred.

Whereas the Lords in the Upper House of Parliament do find, that there are many Petitions concerning Private Persons depending now before their Lordships, and conceive that many more may be brought into that House, if timely Advertisement be not given to the contrary, which may occasion the Repair and Attendance of His Majesty's loving Subjects upon their Lordships, who cannot give a Dispatch to Private Businesses by reason of the many Public and Great Affairs that now lie before them, concerning the Safety and Weal of His Majesty's Kingdoms: It is therefore thought fit, and so Ordered, by the Lords in Parliament, That all Private Businesses shall be hereby deferred, and put off, until the First Day of the next Term, being the 27th of April next; whereof this House doth hereby give Notice to all His Majesty's loving People, to prevent the Charge and Trouble which otherwise the Petitioners might be put unto, in repairing unto this House at this Time.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Lunæ, videlicet, 18^m diem instantis Aprilis, 1642, hora 9^a Aurora, Dominis sic decernentibus.