House of Lords Journal Volume 4: 24 July 1641

DIE Sabbati, videlicet, 24 die Julii.

PRAYERS.

L. Rich Leave to be absent.

Ordered, That the Lord Rich hath Leave to be absent Ten Days, for his Health.

Lake's Petition.

The Petition of Tho. Lake was read, and Ordered to be referred to the Committee for Petitions; and the Cause to be heard on Thursday next.

Trial of Lord Morley, for the Death of Clarke.

Ordered, That Sir Symon Clarke, and the other Complainants in the Cause against the Lord Morley, touching the Death of Captain Peter Clarke, shall, either by themselves or their Solicitors, attend the King's Attorney General, and other His Majesty's Learned Counsel, and instruct them in the said Cause, who are to acquaint the Lords when they shall have received full Instructions in the said Cause; and then their Lordships will appoint a Day peremptorily for the Hearing and Ending of the same, at this Bar.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir Arthur Ingram; who delivered Two Bills, which had passed the House of Commons:

Bills from the H. C.

1. An Act for settling the Earl of Bedford's Estates, etc.

2. An Act for the Certainty of the Forests, etc. which they have assented to, with the Alterations.

Judges of the King's Bench desire the Directions of the House, about Judgements in the Star-chamber.

It was signified to this House, in Behalf of the Judges of the King's Bench, "That the Act now lately passed, for the suppressing of the Court of Star-chamber, refers to a Time to come (videlicet, to 1 Augusti next); but in the Act there is a Passage in the Preamble thereof, after reciting inter al. the Statute of 3 H. VII. and the Statute of 21 H. VIII. in these Words, ["But the said Judges (meaning of that Court) have not kept themselves to the Points limited by the said Statute, but have undertaken to punish where no Law doth warrant, and to make Decrees for Things having no such Authority, and to inflict heavier Punishments than by any Law is warranted"]; out of which Words this Inference hath been made, That all Offences which are not mentioned in that Statute of 3 H. VII. were out of the Cognisance of that Court.

Wotton, committed by the Star-chamber, desires a Habeas Corpus to remove him into The King's Bench.

"Thereupon, in the last Trinity Term, upon a Habeas Corpus brought by one Wotton, a Prisoner in The Fleet, to remove his Body, and the Cause of Commitment and Detainer, into the Court of King's Bench; upon the Return thereof, it appeared, That he was committed in Execution of a Decree of that Court, in a Cause of Challenge for a Duel, upon the Complaint of one Wortham; whereupon the Defendant was decreed to pay to the King Five Hundred Pounds for a Fine, and Two Hundred Pounds for Damages to the Party; and the Counsel for the Prisoner pressed it very much, that he might be discharged, or at least be bailed, because the Offence was none of them which are mentioned in the Stat. of 3 H. VII. And the Opinion of this Parliament now appears by this last Act to be, That the Court of Star-chamber had no Jurisdiction over any other Offences, which are not expressed in the said Act of 3° H. VII.

"The Court of King's Bench took Time to advise thereof (the Parliament now sitting), because it may go far to look back to all the Decrees of that Court, which have been made in Cases not expressed in that Act of 3 H. VII. which are very many in several Ages since that Time; and such a Resolution may much concern the King and the Judges of that Court in all those Times, and the Parties to those Suits:

"Therefore the Judges of the King's Bench humbly pray Direction of this House in this Case."

Conference to be had with the H. C. concerning this.

Their Lordships, taking this into Consideration as a Business of Consequence, (fn. 1) Resolved to communicate it to the House of Commons at a Conference.

Lord Mayor, etc. of London attend, concerning the Loan of 40,000 l.

Then the Lord Mayor, Recorder, Aldermen, and some of the Common Council and Commonalty of the City of London, were called in; and it was propounded unto them by the Speaker, That both Houses do desire to borrow of them Forty Thousand Pounds (besides the Thirteen Thousand Pounds lately borrowed), towards the final disbanding of both Armies; which would be a Thing very acceptable to both Houses, being to (fn. 2) be employed in a Matter as will be so much for the Good and Safety of the Kingdom; and this to be speedily done, and they shall be secured out of the Poll-money. Upon this, the Mayor and Aldermen, etc. withdrew themselves, to consult what Answer to give herein.

Message to the H. C. to sit P. M.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Dr. Bennett:

To let them know, that this House intends to sit at Four a Clock this Afternoon, and desire them to sit also.

Lord Arundel of Wardour Leave to be absent.

Ordered, That the Lord Arundle of Wardour hath Leave to be absent, about his necessary Occasions.

Answer of the Lord Mayor, etc. of London, concerning the Loan.

After this, the Lord Mayor and Aldermen, etc. were called in again; and the Recorder signified to this House their Answer touching the borrowing of Forty Thousand Pounds, which is, "That they are but a few here present; therefore, having no Power to undertake for others, they can promise but for themselves, who are most willing to further the Proposition; and desired Time until Tuesday next to call a Common Council, at which Meeting they will give the best Endeavours and Diligence they can to procure the full Sum speedily; and accordingly they will return an Answer to this House; and that they might be the better able to give Satisfaction to those that lend, they desired to know what Security they shall propound, and for how long Time the Money is to be lent."

The Loan to be secured out of the Poll-money.

The Speaker told them, "That the Money shall be secured out of the Poll-money, and lent for Three Months, but paid sooner if the Poll-money comes in;" and, because it comes in so slowly, the Lords commanded the Lord Mayor to take more Care for the speedy collecting thereof.

Trowell's Cause reported.

This Day the Earl of Pembrooke and Mountgomery reported the Cause of Trowell, etc. referred to him, as followeth: videlicet,

"May it please your Lordships,

"According to your Lordships Order of this 10th of June last, being assisted by Mr. Justice Heath and Mr. Justice Foster, we have called all Parties concerned and desired to be present before us, in the Cause of Richard Trowell and Joane his Wife, and Edward Miller and Katherine his Wife, examined the same, and do humbly present to your Lordships the Opinion and Direction of the said Judges, as they are set down and subscribed to by them, which is left to your Lordships further Consideration; by, —

"May it please your Lordship,

"When we attended your Lordship, according to the Order of the Lords in Parliament, upon the Petition of Richard Trowell and Joane his Wife, and of Edward Miller and Katherine his Wife, touching Lands in Wotton and Hordley, in the County of Oxon, against Thomas Gregory, Gentleman and others; upon hearing Counsel on both Sides, we found the Title of the Lands in Question to depend whether it were Freehold Land held of the Manor of Eiveline, or an ancient Demesne held of the Honour of Woodstocke; the Petitioners making Title to the Lands in Question, as descended to them as Daughters and Coheirs of Christopher Castle their Father, the same (as they affirm) being held by Copy of Court Roll of the Manor of Wotton, which Manor is Parcel of the Honour of Woodstocke, and ancient Demesne Lands; and that all Lands, both Customary and Freehold, of the said Manor do pass by Surrender, as appeareth by the Records of the Court of the said Manor, and the Testimony of the Steward of the said Court, who is ready to make Affidavit of the same, as they affirm; and that, if any Conveyance be made of any Lands held of the said Manor, other than by Surrender in the King's Court, the Parties making such Conveyances do forfeit their Estates. The Defendants affirm, that the Lands are frank Freehold of the Manor of Eiveline, and not ancient Demesne Lands; and, if they were ancient Demesne, yet they are Freehold and not Copyhold Lands, and the Petitioners have no Title thereto, but the Defendants, who claim the same by free Deed. We further find that the Petitioners now are, and so for the Space of about Eight Years past have been, in Possession of all the Lands in Question, but subject to Interruptions of the Defendants, for which and many other Grievances, the Petitioners, by their Petition, desire Relief and Recompence. This being the true State of the Question, we humbly conceive that it is fit that the Possession be quieted with the Petitioners, until the Title be determined by due Course of Law; and, to that Purpose, we hold it most equal that the Defendants Gregory and the rest, if they think fit, may forthwith seal a Lease of the Lands to such Person as he or they shall nominate; and thereupon, in the Name of the Lessee, bring an Ejectione Firmæ, in one of the Courts at Westm. and declare this Term; unto which Action the Defendants shall forthwith appear gratis, and forthwith plead; and the Cause shall be tried at the Bar in Michaelmas Term next; and at the Trial, the Question insisted upon shall be, whether the Lands in Question, lying in Wotton and Hordley, be Part of the Manor of Woodstocke, which is ancient Demesne, or not; and as the Trial shall pass, the Lords may be pleased to give further Order for the Damages, and for settling the Possession and quieting the Title, as in their great Wisdoms they shall think fit; and that all Suits now depending between the said Parties may cease; and that the Ways may be laid open, and the Bridge laid again in Hordley, as anciently it hath been, that the Petitioners may come to their Grounds there without any Lett or Interruption; all which we humbly submit to your Lordships great Wisdom.

"Ro. Foster.
Ro. Heath."

Ordered, That this House doth confirm the aforesaid Certificate; and that the Possession be quieted until a Trial at Law.

Adjourn.

Dominus Capitalis Justiciarius de Communi Banco, Locum tenens Domini Custodis Magni Sigilli, declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in post meridiem hujus instantis diei, hora 4^a, Dominis sic decernentibus.

Post meridiem.

PRAYERS.

Mixing Wines.

Ordered, That the Committees for the Bill against Sophistication of Wines do fit on Tuesday Morning next.

Bill against Recusants.

Hodie 1^a vice lecta est Billa, An Act for the Security of the true Religion, the Safety and Honour of His Majesty's Person, the just Rights of the Subject, and the better Discovery and Punishment of Popish Recusants.

Security of Money to the Yorkshire Men.

Hodie 2^a vice lecta est Billa, An Act for the securing of such Monies as are, or shall be, due to the Inhabitants of the County of Yorke, and the other adjoining Countries, wherein His Majesty's Army is or hath been billeted.

Committed to these Lords following: videlicet,

Their Lordships, or any Four or more of them, to meet on Monday Morning next, at Eight a Clock.

Security of Religion Bill.

Ordered, That the Bill concerning the Security of the true Religion, etc. shall be read on Monday Morning next, if it be a full House.

Message to the H. C. for a Conference concerning the Loan from the City of London.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Dr. Bennett:

To desire a Free Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, presently, if it may stand with their Conveniency, touching the Forty Thousand Pounds which should be borrowed of the City of London.

The Lord Chamberlain, Earl of Warwicke, and Earl of Bristoll, were appointed to speak at this Conference; and to let the House of Commons know the Answer that the Lord Mayor and Aldermen have given for the present.

Lady Ursula Berty's Petition.

Ordered, That the Petition of the Lady Ursula Berty be committed to the Committee for Privileges.

The House of Commons return this Answer to the Message:

Answer from the H. C.

That they will give a present Meeting, in the Painted Chamber, as is desired.

Abuses of Protections.

Ordered, That these Lords following are appointed to consider the Abuses of Protections, and the printed Paper which is set upon Posts in London: videlicet,

Their Lordships, or any Five of them or more, to meet on Monday in the Afternoon, in the Painted Chamber, at Three a Clock; and their Lordships may send to the Lord Mayor of London, to let him know that, if he have any Complaints of this Nature, they be presented to the Lords Committees.

Conference concerning the Loan from the City reported.

Then this House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed; and the Earl of Warwicke reported, "That the House of Commons desired, That their Lordships would quicken the Lord Mayor and Commons of London, to provide the Forty Thousand Pounds as speedily as may be; and to let them know that they shall be secured by the Poll Bill, or Personal Security, and that they shall have Interest for Three Months Time."

Message to the Lord Mayor, &c. concerning it.

Hereupon it is Ordered, That the Earl of Warwicke, Earl of Stamford, the Lord North, and the Lord Grey de Warke, shall go to the Lord Mayor of London, and desire him (from both Houses of Parliament) to call a Common Council on Tuesday Morning next, and propose the borrowing of Forty Thousand Pounds, to be provided as speedily as may be for the final disbanding of both Armies; which Sum is to be secured by the Pollmoney, or Personal Security, for Three Months, with Interest; of this a Speedy Answer is to be given.

Adjourn.

Dominus Capitalis Justiciarius de Communi Banco, Locum tenens Domini Custodis Magni Sigilli, declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Lunæ, videlicet, 26^m instantis Julii, hora 9^a Aurora, Dominis sic decernentibus.