House of Lords Journal Volume 4: 1 February 1641

DIE Lunæ, videlicet, 1 die Februarii.

PRAYERS.

Ld. Mountague excused.

Lord Mountague excused for being absent; and hath Leave to go and see his Wife, being very sick.

Message from the H. C. for examining the Judges about the Lord Finch.

A Message from the House of Commons, by Sir Robert Pye: That the Knights, Citizens, and Burgesses, assembled for the Commons in Parliament, do desire, That the Judges and some others may be examined in the Case of the Lord Keeper Finch, in the Presence of some Lords deputed by this House; and as for procuring his Appearance, and other Proceedings concerning him in this Business, they refer the same unto their Lordships Consideration.

Answer.

The Answer unto the said Message was: That their Lordships will provide there shall be an Examination of the Judges and others accordingly, as is desired.

Jurisdiction of the Admiralty.

Upon reading the Petition of the Right Honourable the Lord Admiral; it was Ordered, That the Proceedings in the King's Bench, or elsewhere, touching the Jurisdiction of the Admiralty, shall cease from any further Prosecution, until the Order of this House be further signified therein; and the further Consideration and Debate of the Business to be heard in open Court upon Thursday Morning next, at which Time the Parties interested are to attend this House.

The Petition of the Earl of Strafford was read, in hæc verba:

Petition of the E. of Strafford, for Time to put in his Answer.

"To the Right Honourable the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in the High Court of Parliament assembled.

"The humble Petition of Thomas Earl of Strafforde, His Majesty's Lieutenant General of Ireland.

"Most humbly sheweth,

"That, in all due Observance to your Lordships Order, he is an humble Petitioner to your Lordships, that he may obtain from your Nobleness and Justice a favourable and competent Time for putting in his Answer to the heavy Charge exhibited against him by the Honourable House of Commons, whose Proceedings against him he acknowledgeth to be just, upon such Informations as have been given by his Unfriends; professing the hard Censure and ill Impression had of him to be the most grievous Misfortune that ever befel him, and more than the certain Loss of his Life, upon any Honourable Occasion for the Service of His Majesty and His People, could have been unto him.

"Humbly beseeching your Lordships to take into Consideration,

"That he stands charged with Treason, and divers other great Misdemeanours, from the first to the last of his having had the Honour to be employed in His Majesty's Service, for the Space of full Fourteen Years; which will necessarily require the looking over of all his Warrants and other Dispatches in Particulars, wherein it is not possible suddenly to recollect himself, being for Actions of his so long since past, as are now utterly forth of his Memory.

"That a great Part of his Charge is fetched from Ireland, and that it is likewise of Necessity to procure from thence his Justification; which will require a great Deal of Time, and Liberty for his Servants to pass to and fro, to bring such Records and other Things as will be requisite for his Counsel to peruse, for the direct Answer to the Charge.

"That it is near Three Months since the Charge began to be collected, and is not (as he humbly conceives) possible to be answered in a few Days; the Particulars being so many, and many of them so long since.

"And that, as the Charge is laid, it is in Case of Blood, which he trusts your Lordships will respect with much Tenderness, and be pleased to consider that any Omission he should chance to make, in not rightly or fully informing his Counsel for the framing of his Answer, might prove Capital unto him.

"And therefore humbly beseecheth your Lordships, as before, that he may have a competent Time allowed him for the putting in of his Answer, the rather considering also the Incertainty of the Winds for passing to and from Ireland; which granted, he is humbly and dutifully assured to make himself appear a Person much more capable of Favour than by any other Means he can possibly be understood to be.

"And lastly, if he have in any Words delivered himself more positively at his last being before your Lordships than he should have done, your Lordships will be pleased to remit it unto him, that always shall have it in his Heart to demean himself with all Duty and Modesty before your Lordships.

"And he shall ever with your Lordships the Continuance and Increase of all Happiness and Honour."

Referred to the Committee for Privileges.

Ordered, That it be referred to the Committee of Privileges this Afternoon, to consider the Form and Manner of proceeding in the Case of the Earl of Strafford, and whether he shall be allowed to cross-examine any Witnesses, and likewise to consider what Time is fittest to allow him to put in his Answer to the Charge.

Leave to Sir George Wentworth to visit the E. of Strafford.

Ordered, That Sir George Wentworth have Leave to repair to the Earl of Strafford, when he shall have Occasion, and at such Times as he shall think fit, being before allowed so to do by the House of Commons, whereof he is a Member.

Countess of Clare Leave to visit the E. Strafford.

Ordered, That the Countess Dowager of Clare, being his Mother-in-Law, have Leave to speak with the Earl of Strafford, as Occasion requires.

Judges Opinions concerning the Titles of the Baronies

Hastings and of Ruthin.

The Judges this Day delivered their Opinions, in the Case of the Lord Grey and Charles Longevile, Esquire, concerning the Titles of the Baronies of Hastings and Ruthin, whether a Possessio Fratris can be upon a Barony by Writ; and it was the unanimous Opinions of the Judges, "That there cannot be a Possessio Fratris in Point of Honour." And, upon somewhat which was spoken of in the Argument, concerning a Power of conveying away of Honour, it was resolved, upon the Question, nemine contradicente,

That no Person that hath any Honour in him, and a Peer of this Realm, may alien or transfer the Honour to any other Person.

Resolved, upon the Question, nemine contradicente,

That no Peer of this Realm can drown or extinguish his Honour (but that it descend to his Descendants), neither by Surrender, Grant, Fine, nor any other Conveyance to the King.

Longuevile's Cause deferred.

Ordered, That the Judgement in Mr. Longevile's Cause, concerning his Title to the Baronies of Hastinges and Ruthine, be deferred until Wednesday Morning next.

Subsidy, and Parliament Bills.

Ordered, That the Lords Committees for the Subsidy Bill, and Bill for Parliaments, do meet To-morrow Morning, and Committees for Petitions to sit in the Afternoon.

The King takes further Time to answer about the Jesuits.

The Lord Keeper signified to the House, That His Majesty had commanded him to tell their Lordships, That He desires a Day or Two longer to advise about the Answer He promised to give, to the Desires of both Houses, about the Priest, and the Execution of the Laws against Jesuits and Priests.

Order to examine the Judges about the Lord Finch.

Ordered, That such Judges as the House of Commons shall desire are to be examined in the Case of the Lord Fynch, by the same deputed Lords as were appointed for to take the Examinations in the Earl of Strafford's Cause; but the Judges are not to be examined upon any Thing to accuse themselves.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Mercurii, videlicet, 3^m diem instantis Februarii, hora nona, Dominis sic decernentibus.