House of Lords Journal Volume 17: 17 February 1703

DIE Mercurii, 17 Februarii.

Domini tam Spirituales quam Temporales præsentes fuerunt:

PRAYERS.

Woollen and Iron Manufactures, &c. to prevent Frauds in, Bill:

The Earl of Stamford reported from the Lords Committees, the Bill, intituled, "An Act for the more effectual preventing the Abuses and Frauds of Persons employed in the working up the Woollen, Linen, Fustian, Cotton, and Iron Manufactures of this Kingdom," as fit to pass, with One Amendment.

Which was read Twice, and agreed to.

Hodie 3^a vice lecta est Billa, intituled, "An Act for the more effectual preventing the Abuses and Frauds of Persons employed in the working up the Woollen, Linen, Fustian, Cotton, and Iron Manufactures of this Kingdom."

The Question was put, "Whether this Bill, with the Amendment, shall pass?"

It was Resolved in the Affirmative.

Message to H. C. with at Amendment to it.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Robert Legard and Doctor Edisbury:

To return the said Bill, and desire their Concurrence to their Lordships Amendment made thereto.

Mutiny Bill.

The Lord North reported from the Committee of the whole House, the Bill, intituled, "An Act for punishing Officers or Soldiers, who shall mutiny, or desert Her Majesty's Service, in England or Ireland; and for punishing false Musters, and for better Payment of Quarters in England," as fit to pass, with One Amendment.

Which was read Twice, and disagreed to by the House.

Hodie 3^a vice lecta est Billa, intituled, "An Act for punishing Officers or Soldiers, who shlal mutiny, or desert Her Majesty's Service, in England or Ireland; and for punishing false Musters, and for better Payment of Quarters in England."

The Question was put, "Whether this Bill shall pass?"

It was Resolved in the Affirmative.

ORDERED, The Commons have Notice, that the Lords have agreed to the said Bill, without any Amendment.

Report of Address of Thanks to Her Majesty, for the small Number of Licenses which have been granted for Persons to come from France, and desiring a Proclamation to apprehend those who are come without.

The Lord Mohun reported from the Lords Committees appointed to draw an Address of Thanks to Her Majesty, for Her great Care in not giving Licenses to more Persons to come out of France; and humbly to desire Her Majesty, "To issue Her Royal Proclamation for the Discovery of any that hath come from France without License, with Reward to the Discoverers of any such Persons," an Address drawn by them.

Which was read Twice, and agreed to by the House, as followeth; (videlicet,)

We, Your Majesty's most dutiful and loyal Subjects, the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, return Your Majesty our most humble Thanks, that You have been pleased, out of Your great Care and Concern for the Peace and Security of Your Majesty's Kingdoms, to be so strict and cautious in the granting of Licenses to the Enemies of Your Majesty and Your good People to resort hither from France, as to have granted such Licenses to Five Persons only.

"And we do at the same Time humbly desire, that Your Majesty would be pleased to issue out Your Royal Proclamation, for the Discovery of any such as are or shall come from France without Your Majesty's License, with such Reward to the Discoverers as to Your Majesty shall seem most proper; and that Your Majesty will also please to direct Your Attorney General, from Time to Time, effectually to prosecute all such Offenders."

Lords with White Staves to attend Her Majesty.

ORDERED, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That the Lords with White Staves do humbly attend Her Majesty, with the Address of this House, agreed to this Day.

Message to H. C. for the Conference about their not complying with the Desire of the Lords, for the Commissioners of Accompts to attend the Committee.

The Earl of Rochester reported from the Committee appointed to consider of the Message received Yesterday from the House of Commons, "That the Committee do not find, by the Precedents they have looked into, any Reasons why the Lords should not give a Conference, as desired by the House of Commons."

To which the House agreed.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Robert Legard and Sir Richard Holford:

To let them know, the Lords agree to a Conference, as desired Yesterday; and appoint it presently, in the Painted Chamber.

Managers for it.

The Messengers sent to the House of Commons return Answer:

That the Commons are come to the Conference.

Hereupon the Lords following were named Managers:

Then the House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference.

Which being ended, the House was resumed.

Report of the Commons Reasons for not allowing the Commissioners to attend; and complaining of the Lords Justification of L. Halifax before he was accused.

And the Lord Privy Seal reported, "That the Lords had met the Commons, as commanded; and that the Commons said, at the Conference,

"That the Commons cannot comply with your Lordships Desires contained in your Message of the Fourth Instant:

"Because the Commons are still of the same Opinion as was delivered to your Lordships, in February One Thousand Six Hundred Ninety-one, at a Free Conference, upon the Subject-matter of the Amendments made by the Lords to the additional Bill for the appointing and enabling Commissioners, to examine, take, and state, the Public Accompts of the Kingdom, when they desired to know the End your Lordships would propose to yourselves by an Inquiry into the Public Accompts; for, should any Misapplication of Money, or Default of Distribution, appear in the Accompts, your Lordships cannot take Cognizance thereof originally, nor otherwise, even in your Judicial Capacity, than at the Complaint of the Commons; and should a Failure or Want of Money appear, it is not in your Lordships Power to redress it, for the Grant of all Aids is in the Commons only; or, if there be any Surplusage, the Commons only can apply it to the Charge of the ensuring Year.

"But, should the Commons give Leave to the Commissioners to attend your Lordships, no Information they can give against any Person whatsoever can entitle your Lordships either to acquit or condemn: Yet, since this Message, the Commons find, in your Lordships Journals, the following Resolution; (videlicet,)

"It is Resolved and Declared, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That Charles Lord Halifax, Auditor of the Receipt of the Exchequer, hath performed the Duty of his Office, in transmitting the ordinary Imprest Rolls to the Queen's Remembrancer, according to the antient Custom of the Exchequer, and the Direction of the Act Octavo & Nono Gul. Tertii Regis, intituled, "An Act for the better Observation of the Course antiently used in the Receipt of the Exchequer;" and that he hath not been guilty of any Neglect or Breach of Trust upon that Account:

"Which looks to the Commons as if your Lordships pretended to give a Judgement of Acquittal, without any Accusation brought before your Lordships, and consequently without any Trial: And, that which makes your Lordships Proceedings yet more irregular, it tends to prejudging a Cause, which might regularly have come before you, either originally by Impeachment, or by Writ of Error from the Courts below; and therefore the Commons can see no Use of this Resolution, unless it be either to intimidate the Judges, or prepossess a Jury.

"But, if your Lordships could have judged in this Matter, it does not appear by your Lordships Journals, that you have had under Examination the respective Times of transmitting the several Imprest Rolls to the Queen's Remembrancer; without which, it is impossible to know, whether the Auditor of the Receipt had done his Duty according to the Act of Parliament."

D. Ormond, and Flag Officers, &c. Journals, Debate upon the Report about them.

ORDERED, That the Report of this Conference shall be considered To-morrow, at Ten a Clock.

The Order being read, for taking into Consideration the Report from the Lords Committees appointed to consider the Duke of Ormond's, and Flag Officers Journals:

The First Part of the Report was considered.

After Debate thereupon;

This Question was proposed, "That it does not appear to this House, that Sir George Rooke Admiral, before or on the Thirteenth of August, did order any View to be taken of the Coast and Soundings between St. Sebastian and St. Pedro, and in the said River?"

Then the previous Question was put, "Whether this Question shall be now put?"

It was Resolved in the Negative.

After further Consideration of the Report;

This Question was proposed, "That the Reason of the Miscarriages in the Expedition to Cadiz was landing the Forces in The Bay of Bulls?"

After Debate;

The previous Question was put, "Whether this Question shall be now put?"

It was Resolved in the Negative.

Then, after further Debate,

It being proposed, "That Sir George Rooke, with respect to the Instructions he received, and the Councils of War by which he acted, has done his Duty, and behaved himself like a worthy and brave Commander, with Honour to the Nation ?"

Vote approving of Sir Sir George Rooke's Conduct.

This Question was put, "That Sir George Rooke, with respect to the Instructions he received, and the Councils of War by which he acted, has done his Duty, and behaved himself like a worthy and brave Commander, with Honour to the Nation?"

It was Resolved in the Affirmative.

It is Resolved and Declared, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That Sir George Rooke, with respect to the Instructions he received, and the Councils of War by which he acted, has done his Duty, and behaved himself like a worthy and brave Commander, with Honour to the Nation.

Persons discharged from their Attendance.

ORDERED, That all Persons who were ordered to attend, be discharged from their Attendance.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque ad et in diem Jovis, decimum octavum diem instantis Februarii, hora undecima Auroræ, Dominis sic decernentibus.