House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 17 February 1610

Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 1, 1547-1629. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1802.

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Citation:

'House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 17 February 1610', in Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 1, 1547-1629(London, 1802), British History Online https://prod.british-history.ac.uk/commons-jrnl/vol1/pp394-396 [accessed 19 April 2025].

'House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 17 February 1610', in Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 1, 1547-1629(London, 1802), British History Online, accessed April 19, 2025, https://prod.british-history.ac.uk/commons-jrnl/vol1/pp394-396.

"House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 17 February 1610". Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 1, 1547-1629. (London, 1802), British History Online. Web. 19 April 2025. https://prod.british-history.ac.uk/commons-jrnl/vol1/pp394-396.

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In this section

Saturni, 17o Februarii, 1609

Timber, &c.

L. 1a. B. FOR the better Breeding and Increasing of Timber, and Underwoods.

Dorchester Rectory.

L. 2a. - Dorchester: - Sir Tho. Freak, Mr. D. James, Sir Rob. Miller, Sir Carey Raleigh, Sir Francis Hastings, Sir Dan. Dan, Mr. Wentworth, Mr. Nich. Hyde, Sir Walter Vaughan, Mr. Hakewill, Mr. Middleton, Sir Jo. Hannam, Sir Rob. Nappier, Sir Henry Poole, Sir John Jeffreyes, Sir Jo. Bennett, Sir James Leigh, Mr. Buddon, Mr. La. Hyde, Mr. Prowe, Sir John Hungerford, Sir Edw. Grevill: - Tuesday, Temple Hall.

Supply.

Mr. Attorney, - The Report of Conference on Thursday last.

In Reports, fruitless Prefaces, and hurtful. -

One Lord only, the 2. Officer of the Kingdom. - Two Hours compleat. -

Nihil deficiens, nihil redundans, in his Speech : - Distributed according to the Commission given.

Two Things * * by the Lords: - Spoke not out of Choice. - Make known the Contentment in that Meeting, granted with Expedition. -

A Preparative to * * which * * * without begging. -

Make Declaration of that, publick to the Lords. - The Lords heard it before. -

The Force of Argument anima audientis, than, -

Object, public Utility, future Tranquility.

Handling - without Distinction of Power, carried in Union of Interests. -

The King, the Head, can receive no more Good from his Subjects, than the natural, where there is Obstruction:

- Dead Palsy.

Declaration : - Two Parts: - 1. Causing of Culling: -

. . Motions fit. -

Motions were such as, pansis manibus apprehend them, require nothing but large Retribution. -

Part - Cause - Supply of Treasure. -

The King offered Ease of just Grievances; - the subject base Creature, Money.

No true Riches, but Food and Rayment. - Nugatur quiddam. - The rest to play withal as Rattles. -

Retribution. - Pulcher thesaurus bene locat. gratior.

2. Cause : - Honour to the Prince to be created Prince of Wales. - Why reserved to Parliament.

This King - Eleven Princes of Wales. - Eight Charters extant. - Three no Parl. Charters - Tradition of Chronograph -

(1.) E.I. Son of King H. III. created at London. -

Pater ejus immortaliter gavisus est. -

E. II. created at Lincolne. - E. III. created at York. -

These Three no Charters. -

Edw. the Black Prince, next. - Rich. of Bourdeaux. -

H. IV. E. IV. H. VII. Two Sons. - Eight whereof Charters. -

Three of these not in Parliament. - E. IV. Son. -

R. III. and R. II. Princes of Importunity. -

This Prince more Royal of Birth; - of great Hope; -

the King's Choice. -

The Parliament no essential Portion in the Power of

creating. -

The Power in sinu Regis: - At a Feast as well. - This Circumstance but a Shell. - In this Prince strange Images: - Externally, much Formosity, Strength, and Activity; internally, Capacity, Promptness, Judgment in Election. -

This Prince - the Title, the Dignity, the Prerogative, the Territory: - A Change in the Form of Government.

- Quoad potestatem, the King's ; quoad dignitatem, the Prince's. -

To be conferred together, the Earldom of Chester. - Rem. all Regalities that are not resumed by a Stat. H. VIII.-

First Earl, Hugo Lupus: - Given by, tenend. ita libere ad gladium, sicut Rex tenet Angliam ad coronam. -

Divided from the Crown till Johannes Scotus. - Heirs Females. -

H. III. resumed it: yet the King's eldest Sons Earls.

- E. I. first created Earl, after it restored. - Earl of Chester, by Creation ; of Flint, by Conquest: - Patron of St. Asaph by that Right. -

Prince also Duke of Cornwall - 11 E. III. by a Charter. - The eldest Son for ever Duke of Cornwall: -

Not creatus, but natus. -

E. III. his eldest Son made Dolphin. -

The King not so able to do for him, as worthy. -

A great Joy, to see the King and his eldest Son live

Men together; great Peril, if Means not sufficient. -

He did what you will believe. - The Proposition easy. - If Things were weighed in the Balance of Justice and Honour - except the Speaker were obnoxious to Flattery.

- Affidavit of a poor Man works enough. - He wittingly no Untruth - Protests the Faith of a Christian.

The Condition of the King's Wants; - the Causes, and Consequence of them.

Sir Fr. Bacon: - From Comforts to Matters of Wants and Dangers. -

From Sentences and Stories, to Computations and Reckonings: - With Brevity and Division. - The Speech is personal: - In Life Grace : - Clearest to work upon. -

Four Parts: -

Representation of Dangers, if in Want.

Description of the State of Wants, and Reduction to the State of an Account.

Pre-occupation of silent Objections: - Not raise, but beat down.

Matter of Inforcement for Impression. -

1. Like a Landskip. - The Offences of this State may come like a Whirlwind. - The Accidents of Breach of Peace foreseen : - Ambition, or Denial of Justice. -

The King subject to manifest, and unknown, if he should not be supplied. - To resist his Enemies, - to free by Diversions, - to help Friends.

He sat next the Storm: - If he should not relate it, the white Staff would ill become him. -

Not interessed in Parliament, but by a fixed Portion, as a poor Peer. -

Three Times the King wants: -

1. When he came to the Crown.

2. A continual Progress till Michaelmas twelvemonth.

- When Treasure was least, greatest Debt.

3. From that Time to this. -

Queen Eliz. of happy and precious Memory. - 700,000l. at the Rebellion, in the Queen's Coffers : - Spent all in these Wars. -

Between the Blackwater, and her Death, amounted to 1, 600, 000l. - Earl of Ess. Year, 400,000l. - Mountjoy, 500,000l. - Coffers empty. - Crown engaged. -

. K. own Time, Two Balances : - 1. Account annual: - Exit. Intro. - 2. Receipts in gross. -

Ordinary: - More than he receives, by 81,000l. besides Contingents and Extraordinaries. - Extraordinaries the fourth Part.

Ireland could not dissolve upon a sudden. - Conscience,

- Fear, - if such a People - Ireland, in the King's Time, 600,000l. -

Receipts in gross. - Remainder of Eliz. Subsi. 300,000l. - Subsid. in his Time, 450,000l. - Aids, 22,000l. - Nobility, 4,000l. - City, 1,000l. - Rest Country. - Privy Seals. - 120,000l. repaid, saving 5, 000l. not to trouble the Accounts. - Receipts, 800,000l. -

Subs, by the Queen: - Take them and pay them. - Redeemed the mortgaged Land. - Take away that fretting of the Copper Money. - Debts in Offices: - Wardrobe, Admiralty. - 300,000l. in this: - The Account cleared. -

600,000l. for Ireland. - 900,000l. for 800,000l. - in Debt 100,000l. - All the Receipts sunk. - Low Countries, 250,000l.

Chain of Expence. - Queen's Obsequies: - The King's Entrance : - Queen's Entrance, - of great Descent, - with her Children, was not like the Wife of an Earl. - King of Denmark magnificent. - Ambassadors sent and received : - Charge of these, 500,000l.

Account by Dorsett Treasurer, in 3o ann. - then short 80,000l. - Gross Debt, 700,000l.

Rebellion of Odoartie: - Ripeness of the Prince: - Building of Ships: - Interest: - Decedence of the 8,000l. annually; - At Michaelmas twelvemonth, 1,400,000l. - Note it, but record it not. - It were a fearful Hearing, to leave there.

The Subsidy strikes off to come, 450,000l. - The Sale

- Parsonages, Mills, Chanteries, 400,000l. -

Other Courses: - Copyholds, Woods, defective Titles,

Assarts, 100,000l. -

Debts: - 30 Eliz. 200,000l. - all 1,100,000l. - Deducted: - Remainder, 300,000l. the King's present Debt-

Will you now see the Ship so near the Port, fall to wreck, your own Fortunes embarked in it: -

Ob. - Precedent. - Not in War. - The King gives. -

A Conceit of greater Debts that might have come in - 600 Years Space, - never asked, that was denied, but three Times. -

E. I. Trayle Batton mighty Sums. -

31 H. VIII. the Parliament released all the King's Debts. -

Queen Eliz. 20 Subsidies; - 18 Clergy, - 39 Fifteens:

- The whole, 2,800,000l.

Father of all Precedents, Reason. - Men of Judgment not, quo itur, but, quo eundum. -

The annual Charge military, 100,000l. annual. - Ireland. - Low Countries. -

Charge of the Navy, 400,000 l. - The Walls : - Fortresses: - Sword-men, not Gown-men, are supported by annual Pensions. -

The King gives de proprio: His Gifts are regular. - Queen 9,000l. by Year, by Way of Restitution: - Mere Donative. - 7,000l. returned to the Clergy. - 200,000l per annum, - Part retracted by Queen Eliz.

Eliz. Grandfather parsimonious, Father prodigal. - Mediocrity End. - She sold her Land, was beholden to her People. - It is much to diminish the Glory by restraining. -

To expose to Contempt by Warrant, Enemy to all Designs. - You cannot be true to yourselves, to your own Hopes, if the King want. -

Antiquaries of Debts. - Chequer-men chattered. - Old Debts since 30. not 1,000l, other better Debts, 200,000l.

The Plantation of Ireland. - The Competition about the Duchy of Cleves. - Austria pretends : - Emperor, for a Decision: - Takes Possession before Judgment. - Religion is hazarded. -

The French King and the King join to defend the

Protestant Party, because evident Right, - Better the Crown were dry, than that so noble should be deserted. - We owe a Tribute of Retribution.

Sir Edwyn Sands: - Part of Retribution and Ease. - Mediate with much Joy, report with - Not long, because often to be reiterated. -

A Descend by divers comely Degrees.

Where it possible, often meet, exchange Thoughts, - prevent Jealousies, - not precipitate our Cause. -

Corpor. in joint Ass. wise; in single, not so. - Exhortation, when meet, our Thoughts might meet.; - They would as well extraordinary Ease, as Supply and Profit. -

Three Passages. - Concerning the King. - The Duty of Kings reciproc. of Subjects. - K. never so great, demand at Pleasure; nor Subjects deny, out ot Humour. - Word without Aspersion to this House. -

Rather a Reason to those from whom we came : - A present Example. -

Printing Proclamations: - A Conceit, that they should be made Laws. -

The King's Power: - His Prerogative. - An -

The true Scale of the King's Prerogative was, when in Concurrence with the public Good : - In some Things inherent and inseparable. -

4. - 1. Impos. upon Foreign Commodities. - To be moderated, not to the Hindrance of Commerce. - Grievance: - His Majesty 1d. Mr. Shopkeeper 12d.

2. Over the Freeholds: - Wardship.

3. Over the Courts of Justice: - Time and Place.

4. Execution of penal Laws: - If to the utmost, it would be unsufferable. - Reasonable Demands with cold Supplies. - Durum telum. -

In the King beatitudo nata, - data. - In his Person the linage of an Angel. - Not only brought, but procured Fruition : - In his Person, not in his Fortune. -

Data: - Uniting of these Two Kingdoms. -

We might see the yellow and red stand in our Window, without breaking. -

E. I. Endeavours to annex. -

H. VII. - Joy to match with the King of Scotland, - Stops the Back-door from all foreign Powers. -

Help desired: - Ease offered. -

In Conformity of Thoughts of Ease, never met with such a Higher House. -

All Commonw. full of Grievance. - For them, they were ready, with Cautions. -

Respect to Sovereignty, - and Modesty. -

He would not press us in the one, as then we should not proceed iu the other. -

Grievous penal Laws. -

An Information against Lenders at Ten in the Hundred, by an Inform' -

Venia est paene remissa: - Sed haec regi sapienti datur, non debetur. -

Proceed' of the Privy Council. - They had considered penal Laws. -

Three Kinds: - 1. Impossible. 2. Not fit at first, now less fit. 3. Defective for Direction, dangerous in Execution. -

The Cause: - Declaration, - Supply, Condition. - Not suffer to languish in an Hectick. - Proceed in Love and Fear to our Prince: - Proceed in tuto et commodo; - Repeated by the Lord Chancellor.